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To: cuban leaf

The Bible states very clearly that most people in history are NOT among the elect.

It would be a good exercise to find the verses which say this, just so we are clear.

Nowhere does the Bible say almost everyone is going to heaven.

We must get OUR IDEA OF JUSTICE, OUR IMPERFECT HUMAN IDEAS OF JUSTICE, out of our head, and rely on God’s Word, the Bible to tell us what is just and what is not. Regardless of how we “feel” or “think”. Justice is not what people say it is, justice is what God reveals in his Word.

Those who are saved are predestined by God to be saved from before the womb.

It would be a great exercise to do a textual search of the Bible for words like preordain, foundation of the world, etc., which will find the appropriate verses.

It’s hard for humans - especially Americans - to accept predestination. Because we think - immediately - (crying like babies) it’s not fair ! It’s not fair ! It’s stacked against us !

But we’re thinking from God’s viewpoint when we whine like that - but we are not God and should not be so presumptive as to try to think about our lives as though we were God. We should think from OUR viewpoint. WE DO NOT KNOW the future. When you don’t know, you TRY. If your boat is sinking - you try to survive. You don’t know, rescue could come in 5 minutes and you’re saved. We can’t have a “fatalistic” attitude because we do not know the future. As we read the Word of God we should be encouraged - because it clearly says we should be ! It exhorts the reader to live a good Christian life.

None of this is difficult to understand.

But people want a) a guarantee of salvation for themselves b) to be able to keep on sinning their same old sins.

People want to slip back into say, adultery. But what if some hot babe comes along and throws herself at me ??? I won’t be able to help myself !!!! I need a Christian theology that will let me commit that future, pre-meditated sin and allow me a loophole.

Too bad for such a person - if a person is already imagining sinning in the future instead of aiming to “put off the old man” and repent and resolve to sin no more - especially sins they KNOW they committed in the past, then they’re not saved at that point. Because when they’re saved they will realize they must completely turn over their life to Christ because they are “bought with a price”.

It’s scary - I know. I wondered - how could I be sure I would not commit sins that had become part of who I was ???


92 posted on 06/04/2014 8:32:27 AM PDT by PieterCasparzen (We have to fix things ourselves)
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To: PieterCasparzen
Ergh... okay, I'll have to make my own rabbit-trail... which is a shame, since many of you points have been so good against the mistaken idea in the original post!

"Those who are saved are predestined by God to be saved from before the womb.

Just for my clarifiation: do you mean this in the sense of "Calvinistic" predestination (i.e. God chooses beforehand those are to be saved, AND those who are to be damned, independent of any free choices of the individuals in question)? "Predestination" can mean many things, and I don't want to mistake your meaning...
96 posted on 06/04/2014 8:42:04 AM PDT by paladinan (Rule #1: There is a God. Rule #2: It isn't you.)
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To: PieterCasparzen

I don’t see anything there that, at the level you present it, I disagree with.


105 posted on 06/04/2014 8:57:42 AM PDT by cuban leaf
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