Posted on 07/28/2014 3:10:13 PM PDT by The Grammarian
I do agree salvation is through faith alone. But will a Christian produce this kind of fruit??
If Protestants are Christian at all, then their denominations are part of the one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church. You should be loyal to your church for that reason alone; but also, most churches' membership vows include being loyal to the church and supporting it "by your presence, prayers, gifts and witness" (from the United Methodist Church membership vows, for example). Surely, your word means something. If you are unwilling to be loyal to that church, then look at that quotation again.
Or, as Kevin deYoung points out in Why We Love the Church, the Church is the Bride of Christ. You cannot say, "I love Jesus, but I hate his Church"--it makes no more sense than saying you love your friend, but hate his wife.
We are the church.
Denominations are not the church.
The church, the Body of Christ, is an organism, not an organization.
Loyalty should be to the Head, which is Christ, not to denominations. Denominations can’t save. Christ does.
As I said before....it's very rare to hear a catholic identify as a Christian.
You must have a very narrow range of encounters.
I was received graciously, far better than I think I deserved.
Ask Mary to help you. If she doesn’t answer, you’re supposed to be a Protestant.
There is a difference between political liberalism that is outright in favor of gross immorality, and political liberalism that believes that gross immorality should be tolerated because God alone is Judge. I don't think the former could call themselves 'good' Christians, but surely the latter's politics is not so immoral as to negate any true faith its proponents may hold.
Os Guinness has a good essay about this in his book The Call: in essence, he says that it is as much a sin to make absolute what God has left relative as it is to make relative what God has made absolute. The Bible doesn't espouse a particular political system, so we shouldn't make it an article of faith that one must adhere to a particular political philosophy in order to be saved.
There is no "Christ and"--no "Christ and conservative," nor "Christ and liberal."
Denominations (or Communions, so as to include the non-Protestant groups) are the Church. One particular Communion may not be able to say that it, and it alone, is the Church--but no particular Communion is without some claim to being part of the one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church.
The Grammarian: What are denominations, but groups of Christians? Denominations (or Communions, so as to include the non-Protestant groups) are the Church.
For someone with your name, better reading comprehension is expected than what you are displaying. If you want to disagree with the metmom assertion of "organism, not an organization," then you should have said so.
But to turn your back on that root point and then make a lot of noise about merely different levels of the very corporatization metmom discriminated from is, I think disingenuous.
In short, you are addressing org charts, while metmom is addressing the divine family of souls who have received Christ in their hearts and minds and lives.
Some people see those two things as separate subjects.
He's a person I'd like to pray with. He's a person I'd like to meet.
Nope...Anyone can call themselves Christians...
But you also say, "denominations are not the church." What are denominations, but groups of Christians?
Denominations are groups of people who call themselves Christians but are in fact made up of Christians and non Christians...It is only the Christians in a denomination who are the church, the Body of Christ...
Denominations (or Communions, so as to include the non-Protestant groups) are the Church.
There is no Church...There are churches...
One particular Communion may not be able to say that it, and it alone, is the Church--but no particular Communion is without some claim to being part of the one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church.
There is no catholic, apostolic church...
You must have a very narrow range of encounters.
This is posted every day as the "Catholic" word of the day.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/3185982/posts
There are at least 17 returns of FR thread using a keyword search of catholic.
the following are phrases from various posters on just this thread up through post 160.
because I look too Catholic....
I used to be Catholic...
First thing they do is attack the Pope and Catholics....
Former Catholic
The free will idea that man is capable of choosing to be saved is a most Roman Catholic idea.
between Protestant and Catholic Christians....
the one, holy, Catholic Church and that,
They are mostly Catholic-haters. Anything, then, that looks remotely Catholic is something they will attack.....
but one thing’s for sure, we Catholics
is”non-Catholics.” Without the Catholic Church their own
...what the Catholic Church....
pro-life and Catholic List: ....
that is what this Catholic has been told
No, its not. Its as common as Protestants claiming the contrary.
Actually, I said 'called Christian'--as in, indirect object. I deliberately left who called people "Christian" open, so as to include all possible answers (including the ones that God calls 'Christian,' i.e., Christ-like).
Denominations are groups of people who call themselves Christians but are in fact made up of Christians and non Christians...It is only the Christians in a denomination who are the church, the Body of Christ...
The Parable of the Tares definitely militates against that particular viewpoint.
There is no Church...There are churches..There is no catholic, apostolic church....
You must not believe the Apostles' Creed, then. "I believe in the holy catholic church, the communion of saints...."
the continued use of protestant is a whole separate issue.
So it is here. I am not addressing 'org charts' while metmom speaks of spiritual states; I reject the presented dichotomy as a false dichotomy born out of a hyper-individualistic soteriology that supposes that we can be Christ-followers in isolation from one another.
============================================
I'm with you.
Why is it called the Apostles' Creed...They never mentioned a Catholic Church...Or communion of the Saints...
Jesus said where two or three are gathered together, He is there in the midst.
Nobody needs a denomination, a building, an organization, whatever, to be a church.
Believers are the church and where believers are gathered together, there is the church.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.