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To: pastorbillrandles

I believe that the apostacy was completed after Emperor Theodosius declarred the Eddict of Thesalonica, wherein, it was punishable by death to believe anything but Nicene Christianity.

Up to that point the Christian Majority was not Nicene.

God’s gospel is not decided by an Emperor through Capital Punishment.

Just as the Jews lost the True Gospel of Christ, so did Christians though coercion and force.

Since that time, all Christian thought has been forced through the lenses of the Catholic Creeds. Orthodoxy is simply seeking to justify the Creeds by scripture and ignoring or twisting evidence that does not justify the Creeds.

In essence, when the Creeds of Christianity became more important than the word of Christ .... the Apostacy was complete.


2 posted on 06/20/2017 6:41:42 PM PDT by teppe
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To: teppe

And let me guess...it took Joseph Smith to restore the true gospel?

Nope, you didn’t get even one thing right in your post.


6 posted on 06/20/2017 10:25:01 PM PDT by boatbums (The Law is a storm which wrecks your hopes of self-salvation, but washes you upon the Rock of Ages)
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To: teppe
In essence, when the Creeds of Christianity became more important than the word of Christ .... the Apostacy was complete.

Speaking of creeds...

Here is MORMONism's own creed:
 
 

Articles of Faith

The Articles of Faith outline 13 basic points of belief of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
The Prophet Joseph Smith first wrote them in a letter to John Wentworth, a newspaper editor,
in response to Mr. Wentworth's request to know what members of the Church believed.
They were subsequently published in Church periodicals.
They are now regarded as scripture and included in the Pearl of Great Price.

 
THE ARTICLES OF FAITH
OF THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER-DAY SAINTS
History of the Church, Vol. 4, pp. 535—541
 
 

  1. We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.
  2. We believe that men will be punished for their own sins, and not for Adam's transgression.
  3. We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.
  4. We believe that the first principles and ordinances of the Gospel are: first, Faith in the Lord Jesus Christ; second, Repentance; third, Baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; fourth, Laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost.
  5. We believe that a man must be called of God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof.
  6. We believe in the same organization that existed in the Primitive Church, namely, apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, evangelists, and so forth.
  7. We believe in the gift of tongues, prophecy, revelation, visions, healing, interpretation of tongues, and so forth.
  8. We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.
  9. We believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.
  10. We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.
  11. We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.
  12. We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.
  13. We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.

Joseph Smith


 

8 posted on 06/21/2017 7:03:01 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: teppe
In essence, when the Creeds of Christianity became more important than the word of Christ...


In essence, when the Doctrines of MORMONism became more important than the words found in the Book of MORMON...


 

Trinity:

 

found in the Book of MORMON        -----------   rejected in the Doctrines and Covenants 

Book of Mormon:

Now Zeezrom said: Is there more than one God? And he answered, No. (Alma 11:28-29)

...and be arraigned before the bar of Christ the Son, and God the Father, and the Holy Spirit, which is one Eternal God, to be judged according to their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil. (Alma 11:44)

...doctrine of Christ, and the only and true doctrine of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, which is one God, without end. Amen. (2 Nephi 31:21)

...praises with the choirs above, unto the Father, and unto the Son, and unto the Holy Ghost, which are one God, in a state of happiness which hath no end. (Mormon 7:7)

...power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son--And they are one God, yea, the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth. And thus the flesh becoming subject to the Spirit, or the Son to the Father, being one God, (Mosiah 15:3-5)

...of Jared, that whoso should possess this land of promise, from that time henceforth and forever, should serve him, the true and only God, or they should be swept off when the fulness of his wrath should come upon them. (Ether 2:8)


"Behold, I am Jesus Christ the Son of God. I created the heavens and the earth, and all things that in them are. I was with the Father from the beginning. I am in the Father, and the Father in me; and in me hath the Father glorified his name." (3 Nephi 9:15)


"And again the Lord called others, and said unto them likewise; and he gave unto them power to baptize. And he said unto them: On this wise shall ye baptize; and there shall be no disputations among you. Verily I say unto you, that whoso repenteth of his sins through your words and desireth to be baptized in my name, on this wise shall ye baptize them--Behold, ye shall go down and stand in the water, and in my name shall ye baptize them. And now behold, these are the words which ye shall say, calling them by name, saying: Having authority given me of Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Amen. And then shall ye immerse them in the water, and come forth again out of the water. And after this manner shall ye baptize in my name; for behold, verily I say unto you, that the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost are one; and I am in the Father, and the Father in me, and the Father and I are one...And thus will the Father bear record of me, and the Holy Ghost will bear record unto him of the Father and me; for the Father, and I, and the Holy Ghost are one." (3 Nephi 11:22-27, 36)

Doctrine and Covenants:

According to that which was ordained in the midst of the Council of the Eternal God of all other gods before this world was, that should be reserved unto the finishing and the end thereof, when every man shall enter into his eternal presence and into his immortal rest. (Section 121:32)

And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife, and make a covenant with her for time and for all eternity, if that covenant is not by me or by my word, which is my law, and is not sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, through him whom I have anointed and appointed unto this power, then it is not valid neither of force when they are out of the world, because they are not joined by me, saith the Lord, neither by my word; when they are out of the world it cannot be received there, because the angels and the gods are appointed there, by whom they cannot pass; they cannot, therefore, inherit my glory; for my house is a house of order, saith the Lord God. And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife by my word, which is my law, and by the new and everlasting covenant, and it is sealed unto them by the Holy Spirit of promise, by him who is anointed, unto whom I have appointed this power and the keys of this priesthood; and it shall be said unto them--Ye shall come forth in the first resurrection; and if it be after the first resurrection, in the next resurrection; and shall inherit thrones, kingdoms, principalities, and powers, dominions, all heights and depths--then shall it be written in the Lamb's Book of Life, that he shall commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, and if ye abide in my covenant, and commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, it shall be done unto them in all things whatsoever my servant hath put upon them, in time, and through all eternity; and shall be of full force when they are out of the world; and they shall pass by the angels, and the gods, which are set there, to their exaltation and glory in all things, as hath been sealed upon their heads, which glory shall be a fulness and a continuation of the seeds forever and ever. Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them. (Section 132:18-20)

Abraham received concubines, and they bore him children; and it was accounted unto him for righteousness, because they were given unto him, and he abode in my law; as Isaac also and Jacob did none other things than that which they were commanded; and because they did none other things than that which they were commanded, they have entered into their exaltation, according to the promises, and sit upon thrones, and are not angels but are gods. (Section 132:37)

 

 

9 posted on 06/21/2017 7:05:47 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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To: teppe
I believe that the apostacy was completed after Emperor Theodosius declarred the Eddict of Thesalonica, wherein, it was punishable by death to believe anything but Nicene Christianity.

Then you believe a fable (one of many spread by the LDS church), because there was no death penalty associated with the Edict of Thessalonica. Churches were confiscated, writings were burned, and people were ordered to live further from the capital city than they wished in some cases, but that was about it.

The idea that heresy was a capital crime against the state came about almost 1000 years later, and was practically dead after another 300 years.

Up to that point the Christian Majority was not Nicene.

Is truth decided by majority vote? If a majority of the LDS faithful decided that Joseph Smith were not a prophet of God, would that convince you that he wasn't?

11 posted on 06/21/2017 3:06:15 PM PDT by Campion (Halten Sie sich unbedingt an die Lehre!)
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To: teppe

“Since that time, all Christian thought has been forced through the lenses of the Catholic Creeds. Orthodoxy is simply seeking to justify the Creeds by scripture and ignoring or twisting evidence that does not justify the Creeds.”

I can assure you that your claim is false.

What causes Mormonism to be forced through the lense of Hindus, the New Age Movement, etc??


12 posted on 06/21/2017 4:50:23 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: teppe
Since that time, all Christian thought has been forced through the lenses of the Catholic Creeds. Orthodoxy is simply seeking to justify the Creeds by scripture and ignoring or twisting evidence that does not justify the Creeds.

Here is the Nicene 'creed'.

Please; for the uninformed; point out just WHAT is wrong with each statement.


1. We believe in one God, the Father, the Almighty, maker of heaven and earth, of all that is, seen and unseen.

2. We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ, the only Son of God, eternally begotten of the Father, God from God, Light from Light, true God from true God, begotten, not made, of one Being with the Father.  

3. Through him all things were made.  

4. For us and for our salvation he came down from heaven: by the power of the Holy Spirit he became incarnate from the Virgin Mary, and was made man.  

5. For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate; he suffered death and was buried. 

6. On the third day he rose again in accordance with the Scriptures; he ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father.  

7. He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and his kingdom will have no end.

8. We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life, who proceeds from the Father.  

9. With the Father and the Son he is worshiped and glorified.

10. He has spoken through the Prophets.  

11. We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.  

12. We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.  

13. We look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come.  

14. Amen.

14 posted on 06/22/2017 4:07:22 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going...)
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