Posted on 08/11/2019 10:21:51 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
As a paraphrase, it should be fine. So for devotional purposes or an “alternative” look The Message can be helpful. Do not under any circumstances use it as a primary source for Scripture or theological study.
Eugene Peterson has had at least one serious lapse in thinking about God’s Word, having to do with sexuality. Doesn’t mean everything he has done is wrong, it just means be careful.
< /my 2¢>
Don’t know who the person is
The Word of the Lord. Sort of.
If it takes a perfect translation to keep you from doing what you darn well know is wrong, then you are looking for loopholes. People want to stick their finger in the light socket without getting zapped.
And every time we do that, Holy Spirit is right there telling us, "Stop doing that and you won't get zapped." And then Jesus heals us from the pain of getting zapped and says, "Forgive them, Father" and Father says, "Okay."
RE: Don’t know who the person is
from WIKIPEDIA:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_H._Peterson
Eugene Hoiland Peterson (November 6, 1932 – October 22, 2018) was an American Presbyterian minister, scholar, theologian, author, and poet.
He wrote over 30 books, including the Gold Medallion Book Award–winner The Message: The Bible in Contemporary Language (Navpress Publishing Group, 2002), an idiomatic paraphrasing translation of the Bible into modern American English using a dynamic equivalence translation approach.
Any translation work done by a single person has both the inherent weakness of a lack of perspective to other’s input but lending to a continuity of style that can be pleasing and effective.
A a paraphrase the reader should understand just what that is, the opposite of a literal rendering by intent to accentuate and convey cultural idiomatic, slang and aphorisms into modern parlance.
My favorite single author translation is William Barclay’s New Testament. Same William Barclay of the Daily study Bible series, all the small colored books that were so popular. He had such a great command of both the English and Greek languages that despite some theological differences his translation is really powerful and edifying.
Gotta get the older hardcover vol 1 and 2 as the binding will come apart eventually on the paperback.
A liberal Presbyterian pastor/professor. He just died recently.
When being first presented with “The Message”, I opened it, and looked at the prayer usually known as “The Lord’s Prayer”.
I now post below an article with which I agree wholeheartedly regarding this work. It is located here: https://gregoryreid.com/as-above-so-below-why-it-matters/
As Above, So Below – Why It Matters
“I did not really understand the spiritual nature of this crisis until I was confronted with the paraphrase, The Message , by Eugene Peterson. Peterson’s “Bible” was very tinged with terms very prone to nature-type analogies that are more familiar to Wiccan and pagan circles than to Christianity.
Something inside was just screaming. It was the same “red light” I have felt on so many occasions and with so many people over the years that indicated something was very wrong spiritually. But this time, I just couldn’t put my finger on it.
It wasn’t until I was put in contact with a man named Warren Smith, a former new ager, that the “red light” made sense. I had a long conversation with Warren, and it helped answer a lot of questions. Then we got down to my problem with The Message. “I just can’t read it”, I told him. “I just don’t feel right about it.” “I can show you why,” Warren replied. “What does the Lord’s prayer read?” he asked. “Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven”, I answered. “Now read it in The Message.”
I found the passage, and as I read it, my blood ran cold.
“As above, so below.”
That phrase doesn’t mean anything to 99% of the populous, and 99.9% of believers. But to those who know and understand the world of the occult and the New Age, it means EVERYTHING. If you were to type that phrase – “As above, so below” into a search engine, and you will come up with 210,000 web site references – that overwhelming majority of which are from occult and/or new age sites. The very first site, an occult definition site, says, “This phrase comes from the beginning of The Emerald Tablet (which, incidentally, is listed as the source of “The Secret” in the first pages of Rhonda Byrne’s book by the same name – g.r.) and embraces the entire system of traditional and modern magic which was inscribed upon the tablet in cryptic wording by Hermes Trismegistus. The significance of this phrase is that it is believed to hold the key to all mysteries. All systems of magic are claimed to function by this formula. “‘That which is above is the same as that which is below’…Macrocosmos is the same as microcosmos. The universe is the same as God, God is the same as man, man is the same as the cell, the cell is the same as the atom, the atom is the same as…and so on, ad infinitum.” (from The Mystica) It has its roots in Egyptian priesthood and magick, and means, among other things, that God and man are equal.
There is no question that this is purely and occult phrase rooted in some of the most ancient forms of “mystery religion” teaching there is, Kabbala, Egyptian magick, Crowlyeyan magick, etc. The phrase is so clear in its meaning, that anyone that uses it deliberately must either (1) Unwittingly use it under the influence of something from the demonic realm, or (2) Knows exactly what it means.
I do not know the author of The Message. What I do know, is that he either had to be unwittingly influenced by something other than the Holy Spirit to write something so absolutely phrase-sppecific to the world of ancient occultism and new age thought, or, God forbid, he does know what it means. I can only pray it is the former, but regardless, it is very terrifying to me that an occult phrase that is so absolutely highly charged with occult meaning and power and RECOGNITION to those in that world, would pass as SCRIPTURE and no one even gives it a glance. Do you understand my concern? If that were the ONLY problem I had with The Message – and it is not – that would be enough for me to never use it again.”
Excerpt from Trojan Church by Gregory Reid
Well stated.
Interesting. You did some digging!
Personally I use the KJV Study Bible with the Greek and Hebrew dictionaries built in and reference in the body of the text. Takes me into the ancient context and amplifies the power and meaning of scripture
I also use other older translations like Tynsdale, Wycliffe and Orthodox Jewish versions
ESV and NIV are to me akin to non fat milk, I can read them but the deeper meanings can only come from the original text
Here's the full passage from BibleGateway.com
Matthew 6:7-13 “The world is full of so-called prayer warriors who are prayer-ignorant. They’re full of formulas and programs and advice, peddling techniques for getting what you want from God. Don’t fall for that nonsense. This is your Father you are dealing with, and he knows better than you what you need. With a God like this loving you, you can pray very simply. Like this: Our Father in heaven, Reveal who you are. Set the world right; Do what’s best— as above, so below. Keep us alive with three square meals. Keep us forgiven with you and forgiving others. Keep us safe from ourselves and the Devil. You’re in charge! You can do anything you want! You’re ablaze in beauty! Yes. Yes. Yes."
Sounds to me like we're being clearly warned AGAINST such occultic practices.
It is not a Bible it is a paraphrase and as such should not be used as a source of Truth or study.
“When you cherry pick particular words or phrases, you can make The Bible say just about anything you want to say.”
______________________________________________________
True. One can even remove God’s words regarding His triune nature:
Authorized King James:
6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
From “The Message”s version of 1 John 5:7
6 Jesus - the Divine Christ! He experienced a life-giving birth and a death-killing death. Not only birth from the womb, but baptismal birth of his ministry and sacrificial death. And all the while the Spirit is confirming the truth, the reality of God’s presence at Jesus’ baptism and crucifixion, bringing those occasions alive for us.[(s15.7)] A triple testimony:
8 the Spirit, the Baptism, the Crucifixion. And the three in perfect agreement.
I read The Message through once and I am happy that I did. I will not do it again but occasionally I look at a particular verse just to see an alternative wording. The Message was intended for people that simply were unable to grasp most translations and I think that’s a laudable goal. There’s truth in all versions and translations but I personally prefer something more literal.
37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
38 And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
The Message
"36 As they continued down the road, they came to a stream of water. The eunuch said, "Here's water. Why can't I be baptized?" 38 He ordered the chariot to stop. They both went down to the water, and Philip baptized him on the spot."
No verse 37. --- "And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God."
The Ethiopian Eunuch
26-28 Later God’s angel spoke to Philip: “At noon today I want you to walk over to that desolate road that goes from Jerusalem down to Gaza.” He got up and went. He met an Ethiopian eunuch coming down the road. The eunuch had been on a pilgrimage to Jerusalem and was returning to Ethiopia, where he was minister in charge of all the finances of Candace, queen of the Ethiopians. He was riding in a chariot and reading the prophet Isaiah.
29-30 The Spirit told Philip, “Climb into the chariot.” Running up alongside, Philip heard the eunuch reading Isaiah and asked, “Do you understand what you’re reading?”
31-33 He answered, “How can I without some help?” and invited Philip into the chariot with him. The passage he was reading was this:
As a sheep led to slaughter, and quiet as a lamb being sheared, He was silent, saying nothing. He was mocked and put down, never got a fair trial. But who now can count his kin since he’s been taken from the earth?
34-35 The eunuch said, “Tell me, who is the prophet talking about: himself or some other?” Philip grabbed his chance. Using this passage as his text, he preached Jesus to him.
36-39 As they continued down the road, they came to a stream of water. The eunuch said, “Here’s water. Why can’t I be baptized?” He ordered the chariot to stop. They both went down to the water, and Philip baptized him on the spot. When they came up out of the water, the Spirit of God suddenly took Philip off, and that was the last the eunuch saw of him. But he didn’t mind. He had what he’d come for and went on down the road as happy as he could be.
“— as above, so below. “
________________________________
I reiterate: This is an occult phrase, and has no place in any writing that claims to be the Word of God.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.