Dear Fellow Theologians, What's the Difference Between "Faith vs Trust"

https://freerepublic.com/~onevike/ ^ | 2/12/21 | OneVike

[OneVike]

Thank you. Much of that I already knew and agree with,

Yet you did add something I did not consider. Thank you very much.

[circlecity]

“for exegetical study I most often reference Dr, Spiros Zodhiates’ The Complete Word Study Old Testament and The Complete Word Study New Testament with Greek Parallel”

Roger that. I’ve got to have a good reverse interlinear and a copy of Zodhiates at hand to do any real textual study.

[Pilgrim's Progress]

All one has to do is cross reference. Jesus quoted that commandment and said it meant murder.

“He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness” (‭‭Matthew‬ ‭19:18)‬ ‭KJV‬‬

[left that other site]

This is just a personal interpretation, and is by no means based upon the finer points of Koine Greek, or even Theology:

Every time you get on an airplane, you have FAITH in the laws of motion, gravity, and aerodynamics.

And you TRUST that the pilot is trained, capable, and not inebriated.

FAITH is in something you can’t see, but you still believe in.

TRUST is a transitive verb with an object (the Pilot).

Just my 2 cents.

[ducttape45]

Wow, that's actually a good topic to discuss.

My first inclination is to find both those words in the Old and New Testament and find out meanings as found in the most reliable concordance. I use the Strong's. This could be lengthy.

Faith

New Testament

pistis

persuasion, that is, credence; moral conviction (of religious truth, or the truthfulness of God or a religious teacher), especially reliance upon Christ for salvation; abstractly constancy in such profession; by extension the system of religious (Gospel) truth itself: - assurance, belief, believe, faith, fidelity.

This is the one I found most prevalent in the New Testament, and it's found in many places. In the Old Testatment, however, I found the word faith used only twice. (Bear in mind that I use the King James exclusively, sometimes referring back to the 1599 Geneva Bible.)

Old Testament

ay-moon'

established, that is, (figuratively) trusty; also (abstractly) trustworthiness: - faith (-ful), truth.

or

'ĕmûnâh

literally firmness; figuratively security; moral fidelity: - faith (-ful, -ly, -ness, [man]), set office, stability, steady, truly, truth, verily.

As for the work "Trust," I found this:

Trust

New Testament

elpizō

From G1680; to expect or confide: - (have, thing) hope (-d) (for), trust.

or

peithō

A primary verb; to convince (by argument, true or false); by analogy to pacify or conciliate (by other fair means); reflexively or passively to assent (to evidence or authority), to rely (by inward certainty): - agree, assure, believe, have confidence, be (wax) content, make friend, obey, persuade, trust, yield.

Old Testament

châsâh

A primitive root; to flee for protection; figuratively to confide in: - have hope, make refuge, (put) trust.

bâṭach

A primitive root; properly to hie for refuge; figuratively to trust, be confident or sure: - be bold (confident, secure, sure), careless (one, woman), put confidence, (make to) hope, (put, make to) trust.

I hope this gets you started in the right direction. Let me know if I can of further assistance.

[Therapsid]

Trust is The most valuable human commodity... faith is a whimsical I’ll defined “ Feeling/Belief” used to justify inaction ,Complacency and apathy in the face of evil...? Lol ... neither one is really tangible or measurable one is human-based and one is Etheral

[molewhacka]

You may be interested to learn Dr. Frank Logsdon, the former chief editor of the NASV, later disavowed the NASV in favor of the KJV due to serious doctrinal issues resultant from using Westcott-Hort derived texts. The same problems exist with the ESV.

Some of many example verses where the significant doctrinal issues arise (compare KJV or other Majority Text-based translations to the NAS, ESV, NIV or other Minority Text-based translations) include:
Matthew 6:13, 9:13, 17:21, 18:11, 23:14, 27:35
Mark 7:16, 9:44, 11:26, 15:28
Luke 4:4, 4:8, 11:2
John 1:14, 3:15, 3:16, 6:47
Acts 8:37
Romans 8:1

There are many, many other passages (both Old and New Testament) where the difference in the underlying text dramatically impacts doctrine, and that does not even factor variation from translation methodologies.

If you would like a more extensive parallel comparison, feel free to DM me.

[ducttape45]

There is a program I use called e-Sword. Once installed you can download many items like bibles, commentaries, concordances and lots of other stuff. That's what I use for this kind of study.

e-Sword

[Arlis]

Agree totally, but would a the Darby translation as one that is brutally literal - so much so it is hard to read.

But good for study and research.

And no - not a Darybyite....

[ducttape45]

Good thing to point out.

That's why I never use anything except for the KJV and Geneva Bible, with the Strong's Concordance.

Westcott & Hort were two of the biggest scam artists the religious community ever encountered, and it's a shame more people don't realize that.

[OneVike]

So in the KJV, God said, OH, I was wrong when I told Moses not to kill, I meant murder.

clean it up all you want, but it’s wrong.

Besides, I guess all those humans who cannot read English are lost since they cannot read the KJV, and the translations they have made from the same transcripts the such modern versions like the NKJV, NASB, etc, etc is just leading all this non English speaking heathens straight to hell, because if the KJV was good enough for the Apostles it is good enough for us.

[OneVike]

Thanks.

[OneVike]

Thanks. I knew all that, but thanks anyway

[OneVike]

I have it.

And I use it, but I am looking for more

[molewhacka]

Prior to purchasing Zodhiates’, I needed a big table for all of the Greek texts, grammars, dictionaries, commentaries, etc. Though I do not consider Zodhiates’ work to be inerrant and infallible, I have yet to come across anything in his works that is doctrinally unsound. As much as may be possible, his work stands as an objective tool by which to study the Holy Bible.

Of course, without the intercession of the Holy Spirit, one can never begin to comprehend the life and power and sharpness and discernment Scripture manifests in our lives.

[molewhacka]

Sounds like you are already on solid footing,

As noted in an earlier comment, you may wish to add e-Sword (e-Sword.net, free download) to your toolbox. It contains a lot of resources - more than I will ever have the time to utilize this side of Heaven.

[fidelis]

Thank you for the invitation to weigh in.

I agree with those who said it is important to uncover, and then place the stress on, what the original meaning of the text (in it's context) was to the original listeners. Only then can we make a corollary to what it might mean to us in English. That is only proper exegesis.

Having said that, it seems to me that trust is only part of what is meant by faith in the New Testament. Faith involves what we think of as trust, but it also means much more. It also involves committing one's self to the object of faith-- in this case God or Christ. This commitment is much more that intellectual acknowledgement or creedal "said" faith, but also results in obedience and the willingness to suffer the loss of all things.

To use trust and faith interchangeably or synonymously or substituting truth when the text says faith (pistis), for example, would not serve the reader well.

[yournamehere]

Some very noteworthy points made here that I can respect

Trust is something that is gained though experience.
Faith is that trust in the unknown, with or without experience.

For example, I trust my friend, and I have faith in him that
he would make the right decision if he was put into an unknown situation.

Hope that helps.

[OneVike]

Thank you for your input.

and I agree

[DavesRepaircom]

I mean no disrespect, but in reference to your signature line: A more pressing question, relevant to this thread discussing the copyrighting of yet another unneeded counterfeit “bible”, is:
“Will my name be *deleted* from the Lamb’s Book of Life for mishandling His *words*?”, Rev 22:19
(That text states that someone will lose their salvation for deleting God’s *words*)