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To: xzins; winstonchurchill; Revelation 911; The Grammarian
This is how one Calvinist describes Irresistable grace.
God, then, must do something in the sinner to make him willing(emphsis mine). And his he does through irresistable grace. Note that the text says 'unless the Father draw him' The Father sends the Spirit to 'draw' the sinner to Christ in a special way. Now, non-Calvinists may agree up to a point here. The usual view is that the Spirit draws all men who hear the Gospel. Well, the Spirit does draw all who hear, but not all in the same way (emphasis mine). The general calling (emphasis mine) is always resisted and rejected, but there is another calling, which is referred to here. It always wins....The point is simply this: when God sets out to save some one of the elect, He so works on his heart that he successfully overcomes all resistance. He irresistablly and efficaciously draws the sinner to Christ. It never fails....Irresistable Grace is simply the comination of electing grace and omnipotence. (The History and thelogy of Calvinism, Daniel, p.379-80)
What is important in this statement is how clever it is!

Irresistable grace changes the will so that the man wants to believe, thus, when we say that one must freely yield or assent, the Calvinist can say, 'we teach free will also'

Two, they also maintain that man does resist God in the general call.

Hence, knowing that the Scriptures teach that man has a will and a decision to make, the Calvinists very cleverly use the terms while distorting their meaning.

Thus, they can say with a straight face that man does have 'free will' 'must willingly believe' and 'can resist God', thus, you do not really understand Calvinism.

This is real 'Jesuit' stuff here!

Hence, you must always bring the debate back to its root, unconditional vs conditional election, since they have distorted every point of TULIP to make it mean whatever they choose it to mean.

9 posted on 07/26/2002 2:51:14 AM PDT by fortheDeclaration
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To: fortheDeclaration; Hank Kerchief; The Grammarian; Revelation 911
but there is another calling, which is referred to here. It always wins....The point is simply this: when God sets out to save some one of the elect, He so works on his heart that he successfully overcomes all resistance. He irresistablly and efficaciously draws the sinner to Christ. It never fails....Irresistable Grace is simply the comination of electing grace and omnipotence. (The History and thelogy of Calvinism, Daniel, p.379-80)

And it is this point that is wrong. It is wrong scripturally.

Since it's wrong, that means one of the so-called calvinist "elect" can resist, be an unbeliever, and STILL be in heaven because of calvin's horrible decree.

12 posted on 07/26/2002 5:31:26 AM PDT by xzins
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