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Putting belief aside: pragmatism versus the Bible
smh.com.au ^

Posted on 06/25/2003 8:18:30 PM PDT by chance33_98

Putting belief aside: pragmatism versus the Bible

By Kelly Burke June 25 2003

"A necessary evil" is how Richard Edlin, a Christian educator and advocate of parent-controlled schools, views the Higher School Certificate examinations.

"The HSC is not a natural expression of the Christian curriculum of the school," says the former missionary and principal of the National Institute for Christian Education.

"But whether we like it or not, people marking the HSC exam, generally speaking, are not committed to a Christian view of intelligent design. They're committed to an evolutionary framework. We've got to prepare our kids to sit that exam because that is the world in which they live . . . So we help them to see that [evolution] is not a biblical perspective but 'Hey guys, if you want to get a good answer in the HSC that's what you've got to write'."

So does pragmatism override biblical truth? Mr Edlin shrugs.

"You can write an answer from a non-Christian point of view but that doesn't mean you have to believe it."

The prickly subject of creationism and its place in the Christian classroom is one to be broached with care.

At parent-controlled Christian schools such as Tyndale, in Sydney's south-west, the Bible is paramount and the ultimate reliable and authoritative source.

But this does not mean that the Bible is used as a scientific textbook, says the school's deputy principal, Bill Rusin.

"Reading the Bible is much more complex than that and there are a range of opinions.

"That God created the world - that man is not an accident - that is not under discussion.

"But how that happened is negotiable.

"The brighter kids will say, 'I'm not sure', others will say, 'This is what my parents believe so that's what I believe' . . . and we don't push anything further than that. We need to respect that."

Students at Tyndale learn from an early age that science cannot explain everything.

Despite the world's seeming randomness and chaos, God is in control, and each individual was made a particular way because that is the way he created them.

"We can make sure they have the tools, the knowledge, to seriously critique unbibilical perspectives," says Mr Edlin.


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1 posted on 06/25/2003 8:18:30 PM PDT by chance33_98
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To: Admin Moderator
Can you move this to religion please? My Bad.
2 posted on 06/25/2003 8:19:47 PM PDT by chance33_98 (http://home.frognet.net/~thowell/haunt/ ---->our ghosty page)
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To: chance33_98
Why move it? It deals with science as well. It is just not dealing with the Naturalistic explanation that is the current dogma of some of the science community.

The issues of evolution, origins, and creation are not science anyway - they are the subject of philosophy. No one was there to witness the origin of the universe, and so far, no scientific experiment has been able to reproduce that origin, much less the origin of life. So the debate must be left to the philosophers, not the scientists.

3 posted on 06/25/2003 9:10:56 PM PDT by LiteKeeper
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To: LiteKeeper
I thought it might have more staying power here :)
4 posted on 06/25/2003 9:11:32 PM PDT by chance33_98 (http://home.frognet.net/~thowell/haunt/ ---->our ghosty page)
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To: chance33_98
You are probably right. But I am so tired of creationism having to take a back seat. The body of evidence is growing daily to support the creation model; and it is dwindling fast for the evolution model.

A Young Earth Creationist

5 posted on 06/25/2003 9:23:19 PM PDT by LiteKeeper
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To: LiteKeeper
A Young Earth Creationist

I am an Old Earth Creationist, and I am not sure why you are a Young Earth Creationist, because a Young Earth is incompatible with Creation.

Let me explain.

It has to do with relativity, and not the E=mc^2 kind. If a man that was reported to be 98 stood before you, would you call him old, young, or don't know? (clue:most would answer "old" because he is closer to death than to birth). Likewise, many Christians believe that we are living in the "Last Days" which would imply that the Earth is approaching its death, and is thus closer to its "death" than to its "birth". Furthermore, according to Scripture, of all creating things, the Earth is the oldest object in the Universe (Sun,moon and stars come four days later). Ergo, the earth is the oldest object in the universe and is by many people's estimation quickly approaching it's death, that, by definition would make it "old" not "young".

So how are you a "Young Earth Creationist"?

6 posted on 06/25/2003 9:35:29 PM PDT by Dr Warmoose (Just don't leave any brass with your fingerprints on it behind, OK?)
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To: Dr Warmoose
A generally accepted definition of a Young Earth Creationist is one who believes that God created the heavens and the earth sometime in the recent past, i.e., 6000 years ago, give or take a few. This, as opposed to an old earth creationist who wrongly sides with evolutionists, accepting the speculations of fallible men who were not witnesses to creation, and therefore, believing that the earth was created billions of years ago.

In the spirit in which i took your comments about an Old Earth, I believe that God created the universe with the appearance of age: trees and plants were fully grown, animals were created mature and prepared to reproduce after their kinds, and that Adam and then Eve were created adults, not infants...fully able to reproduce, think, converse (with each other and with God), and fully capable of undertaking the tasks God gave them - to reproduce (be fruitful and multiply) and fill the earth.

7 posted on 06/25/2003 9:49:36 PM PDT by LiteKeeper
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To: chance33_98
I don't think it is a bad thing at all for the students to be taught evolution, and all of its fallacies. Teach them to answer the questions correctly. They will be better prepared to stand on their own two feet, and, as long as the creation model is taught as well, they will be far better informed than their mates, who only know the evolution model.

Implication: teach them to think; don't indoctrinate - with either model.

8 posted on 06/25/2003 9:52:34 PM PDT by LiteKeeper
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To: PatrickHenry; Junior; Right Wing Professor
crevo
9 posted on 06/26/2003 4:16:26 AM PDT by Chancellor Palpatine (road trip.....)
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To: Chancellor Palpatine
Thanks for the ping, but I'm so far over on the science side of things that I suspect this won't be my style of thread.
10 posted on 06/26/2003 7:04:09 AM PDT by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas.)
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To: PatrickHenry
Shock (( SOON )) -- revelations (( designed universe )) ... AWE --- you haven't seen anything - yet

... unprecedented ---

Syllables: un-prec-e-dent-ed

Part of Speech adjective Pronunciation uhn preh sih dehn tihd

Definition 1. having no precedent; never before observed or experienced.

Related Words prodigious , original , phenomenal , novel , miraculous

11 posted on 06/26/2003 10:31:23 AM PDT by f.Christian (( Shock -- revelations (( designed universe )) ... AWE --- you haven't seen anything - yet ))
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12 posted on 06/26/2003 10:51:38 AM PDT by PatrickHenry (Everything good that I have done, I have done at the command of my voices.)
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To: LiteKeeper
In the spirit in which i took your comments about an Old Earth, I believe that God created the universe with the appearance of age

I agree.

Let me explain my position.

We know that certain things are scientifically explainable and required millions of years to happen. Plate tectonics. Volcanos. Erosion. Grand Canyon. Sea shell on the tops of mountains. Metamorphic rocks. Coal, oil, diamonds, etc.

I see the history of the universe as like a 1000 page novel. God created the whole thing and started us at page 984. There is a history of everything that happened.

Back to the case of Adam and Eve. It takes people a year to "learn" the muscle movements required to walk. Several years to "learn" to use the lips and tongue to create words. (Try to make Japanese or Arabic words if you learned English. Some require great effort and learning.) God created Adam and Eve with this history of "learning" built in.

13 posted on 06/26/2003 11:37:03 AM PDT by Onelifetogive
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To: chance33_98
"'Hey guys, if you want to get a good answer in the HSC that's what you've got to write'." "

________________

It has been my personal experience, that MOST or MANY teachers/professors will grade their tests based upon THEIR own opinion, rather on actual objective reality.

If one wishes to score well, one must give the answer the testor wants.

Whether to answer with what WE conceive to be the truth, rather what the testor preceives to be the truth, requires an ethical decision: is giving a "truthful" answer of a higher value, or is getting a good grade?

If the answer seems obvious, consider this: These questions, on a test which (apparently) decides college placement, are, in effect, the first "screening" in the process which keeps (or attempts to keep) anyone who is not "of the Faith" (ie, evolution as faith) being allowed to obtain a degree in plaeontology,etc. If seen in this way, giving a "true" answer on this test will (potentially) have the effect of strengthing the false religion of evolution.

Furthermore, consider how this sould work out, in the workplace: The boss calls a meeting of managerial employees. He says,"We are not doing well, financially. What can I do, to make a profit?"

Should a Christian employee give the "TRUE" answer: "You need to fire yourself, and hire someone who is not a complete fool, to manage the company;" or would some more diplomatic (if somewhat less ABSOLUTELY true) answers be more appropriate, and effective?

This is not an easy question.

DG

14 posted on 06/26/2003 12:08:29 PM PDT by DoorGunner (DG=Fool, Liar, and sinner, [and apparently doesn't have a "life."] (Non Hæretico Comburendo))
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