The FReeper Foxhole Remembers Morgan's Raid (July, 1863) - Jan. 15th, 2004

"Lexington" ^ | 1975 | Mary Wilson and Sharon Y. Asher

[Humal]

"The pow camps on both sides were miserable hellholes with disease taking a large toll in lives. You were almost better off getting killed on the battlefield."

This is so true. Another uncle from a different line was wounded at Shiloh, taken to the federal prison at Perryville, Kentucky, where he died a month later. I can't imagine the pain and suffering the man went through during that time.

[Humal]

snippy,
My uncle's step-brother is listed in the list of graves. There are links at the end of the article, and the one linking to the names of graves at the end has him listed. The only thing is his date of birth is wrong, according to family records, and he is listed under his step-father's last name "Brown" instead of "Bartlett", his name.

I will forward this to a number of family researchers. Thank you again for the information.

[SAMWolf]

The Severity of the War

     The severity of the war measured in the number of casualties on both sides is a moral tragedy within itself.  There were more Americans killed and wounded in the "The War for Southern Independence" than most all other American wars combined.

	Killed	Wounded
Revolutionary War	4,435
War of 1812	2,260
Mexican War	13,283
Spanish American	2,446
World War I	116,708	204,002
World War II	405,316	670,846
Korean War	36,916	103,284
Vietnam War	58,193
TOTAL	639,557	978,132

--------------------------------------------

North

South

Total
Died and Wounded			*1,166,850
Died	405,850	260,000	665,850
Prison camp deaths	22,576	26,436	49,012

(some sources put total POW deaths at 55,200)     

[snippy_about_it]

That's great. Hopefully you can have the information corrected.

[Valin]

Birthdays are good for you. Statistics show that the people who have the most live the longest.

[Valin]

Hate grits...

I have a firm policy when it comes to food. I eat nothing that's been socked in lye! So far it seems to be working out real good.

[Humal]

Sam,
According to "Civil War Trivia and Fact Book" by Webb Garrison, p. 166, Federal numbers killed or mortally wounded in battle were 110,100; numbers died of disease were 224,580. For the Confederates, the numbers were 94,000 killed or mortally wounded in battle; 164,000 died of disease.

There were nearly 30,000 casualties for one day's fight on one day at Sharpsburg/Antietam. (p. 144) 51,112 combined dead, wounded, or missing for the two armies at Gettysburg. (p. 152) At the Battle of Franklin, Tenn., there were 6,000 Confederate loses and more than 2,000 Union losses (p. 161) At Cold Harbor, at least 6,800 Federals died in less than 10 MINUTES! (p. 161) The estimated number of prisoners of war estimated to have died were 23,000 Federal prisoners and more than 26,000 Confederate prisoners (p. 163).

On p. 154 it says there were 200,000 blacks eventually served in the Union army & navy. You had an article on this a while back. I couldn't find the figures then.

This is a fascinating book chocked full of statistics about the War Between the States. Just don't care for its title. :-)

[SAMWolf]

I just grabbed the numbers from that huys site becasue it was the only on eI found quicly that listed POW deaths. I'll have to go look up the numbers in some of my reference books.

Have to agree the word "trivia" doesn't sound very well used in a book on the War Between the States.

[PhilDragoo]

Just watched From China With Love

Katrina Leong, FBI Special Agents J.J. Smith and Bill Cleveland. 1981-2003 she was an informant for the FBI and was working for China--and doing both these [married] agents.

Trial this fall. Attorneys for Smith and aka Parlor Maid aka Lao say they're being persecuted.

Notra Trulock appeared on program [freeper ntrulock] and said Peter Lee (Royal Tourist) and Wen Ho Lee (Kindred Spirit) cases went screwy 97-99--when the Chinese bimbo was doing the Feebs.

Well duh I recall the circus of Wen Ho:

Freeh requested wiretaps and search warrants on Wen Ho Lee--and it was the ONE case of HUNDREDS that Janet Crocodyke Renocerus REFUSED.

FBI searched Wen Ho Lee's home in White Rock--got lost en route, stopped for bogsat (bunch of guys standing around talking), neighbors thought they were men on way to sporting event.

FBI searched for three hours and only found the flashlight they'd lost--well, duh, Wen Ho Lee had a YEAR to clean house.

I mentioned to others at the lab that he worked at odd hours when he knew no one else would be around; these lab people said oh but the time clocks are not accurate (!) in the same conversation in which they remarked how haughty the Chinese workers were (!).

So full of the ChiCom line (!) and let us not forget the fire started new moon May 2000 burning 50,000 acres, causing evacuation of LANL for a week while Richardson was Energy Sec and Buddy Young was FEMA regional--

Subsequent discovery that a couple of hard drives of foreign nuclear weapons were missing from emergency response team lockers--yet "found" in an area previously searched.

I have the Notra Trulock book Code Name Kindred Spirit which I get to read after I finish Losing bin Laden.

[SAMWolf]

Between Buddist monks, guidance systems technology transfers, Alamogordo fires, missing disks, etc. it seems the Communist Chinese were running the country during clintons 8 years.

[Humal]

Sam, with all the knowledge you have imparted over the years on history and war, your library must rival the Library of Congress. If you have room for one more book, I would recommend the "Civil War Trivia and Fact Book" by Webb Garrison. My criticism of the title refers to "Civil War". It wasn't.

Please don't think I was demeaning your facts and figures. You got them far more quickly than I could.

[SAMWolf]

No problem, Humal. That's the problem with the net, lots of info out there and if you're in a hurry it's hard to verify.

I'll have to look into getting that book, sounds like it'll go well with my "WWII Facts" and "Vietnam War Facts" books.

LOL! about the "trivia".

Here's an interesting view I've seen in a few places.

The Proper Name of the War

There are several different names that have been given to this war that readily identify the personal feelings of the advocate of each name. The most well-known name or term used to identify this war is the "Civil War". The military conflict of 1861-1865 was not a civil war, because it does not fit the definition of that term. By definition a civil war is a 'war between opposing groups of citizens of the same country for the purpose of gaining or retaining control of the ruling government'. The Vice President of the Confederate States of America (CSA) Alexander Stephens said, "The real object of those who resorted to secession was not to overthrow the government of the United States, but instead to perpetuate the principles of law upon which it was founded." Years before he became the president, Abraham Lincoln made the following statement in favor of the constitutional right of secession, yet when several Southern states seceded during his administration, he denied them that right by armed aggression. Lincoln once stated,

"Any people, anywhere, being inclined and having the power have the right to rise up and shake off the existing government and form a new one that suits them better...any portion of such people that can, may revolutionize and make their own of so much of the territory as they inhabit."

The "official" designation by which this war is called in the United States archival records is "The War of the Rebellion." In reading the 'official' records of this war, one must keep in mind that the victor always writes the history in their favor. Therefore, the victor is always the hero and the vanquished is the villain. Another name by which this war is called is "The War Between the States" which is not altogether correct because the States of the North and the states of the South were no longer sister states to one another during the war. The southern states that seceded from the Union did so by lawfully exercising their rights as guaranteed by the United States Constitution. These seceded states then formed a confederation of states and adopted the official name of "The Confederate States of America." Soon after the formation of this new government in Montgomery, Alabama a bloody war ensued in order to retain the right of secession so, therefore, this war is also known as, 'The War of Secession.'

There are two names which can rightfully be used in describing this war. The first one is, "The War Against Northern Aggression," because the majority of the battles were fought on southern soil. The Union troops from the North viciously invaded the countryside, farms, towns and cities of the South with the obvious purpose, to burn, plunder, and declare war not only against the southern army, but also against the southern citizenry. Therefore, it became obvious to the civil and military leadership of the South that they were fighting not only for governmental independence, but for their very physical survival against the brutal attacks of Northern aggression.

The other name by which this war is rightfully called is 'The War for Southern Independence,' because it correctly describes the purpose of the South for which they fought. The purpose of the political and military leadership of the South was not to conquer or to destroy the federal government of the United States, but simply to maintain an independent and sovereign nation in the southland known as the Confederate States of America.

[Valin]

Streaming vidio on Sat. latenight time for bed bump.

[E.G.C.]

BTTT!!!!!!

[Humal]

Good morning, Sam. I just found this message this morning, and it's good information. It seems I've read there were 16 names for The War (one of the names), and there could have been more. The War of Northern Aggression is my favorite. Another name was "The Boys War", because the combatants on both sides were so young. I guess though that if statistics on any war were checked, "Boys War" could apply to any of them.

[Darksheare]

*ugh*
Yeah, they kinda swiped the idea a little..

[Darksheare]

I just got looked at funny...

[colorado tanker]

Gee, Phil. D'ya think some Rosenberg ripped off the plans to the B-1?

[stand watie]

YEP, i've seen it.

free dixie,sw