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This is a big mistake. If you don't like $2 gas, how you gonna feel about $10 a gallon hydrogen? Hydrogen is derived from oil, natural gas, or electricity; it don't grow on trees.
1 posted on 01/09/2002 3:40:24 PM PST by John Jamieson
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To: John Jamieson
Money spent on opec oil is money sent to the Satan for Satan's purposes. Hydrogen would be a bit more expensive at first but would ultimately be cheaper and it would be a hell of a lot cheaper when you add the cost of rebuilding another western city every other year or so into the cost of oil.
2 posted on 01/09/2002 3:58:07 PM PST by medved
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To: John Jamieson
This is a big mistake.

I agree. My MS thesis (not too many years ago) was on advanced vehicle technologies. Part of my MS requirement was also to write a proposal for this DOE project.

Although several automakers -- including DaimlerChrysler AG, Ford Motor Co. and General Motors Corp. -- have said they expect to have fuel-cell vehicles in showrooms within the next four or five years, wide availability of such cars is probably a decade or more away.

Fuel Cell vehicles won't happen any time soon. The next evolving vehicle will be hybrid electric. People are not going to sacrifice PERFORMANCE for an expensive toy. Watch 'em in Califonia starting to back-up on their emmissions and "ZEV's" (Zero Emmision Vehicle) mandates they set forth back in the early 90's for this year.

A natural gas - Electric hybrid is what I predict when they get through playing with the gasoline-electric hybrids. There is already a fair infastructure in place for this. Fill your car up in your garage! Hybrids are on the market and the market for them will expand.

4 posted on 01/09/2002 4:15:28 PM PST by Down South P.E.
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To: John Jamieson
"This is a big mistake. If you don't like $2 gas, how you gonna feel about $10 a gallon hydrogen? Hydrogen is derived from oil, natural gas, or electricity; it don't grow on trees.

Even if you derive the hydrogen from oil or natural gas, the increased efficiency of the total fuel cell-electricity-electric motor-mechanical energy combination cycle is still sufficiently more efficient than the thermal engine-mechanical motion (gasoline or diesel)cycle to make it cost effective.

5 posted on 01/09/2002 4:18:58 PM PST by Wonder Warthog
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To: John Jamieson
I do not know anything about Hydrogen or fuel cells, and as I read this thread I found conflicting information, and so I did a google search on the subject.

I found several different sites (you can do your own search) but this seems to be a fairly clear cut description of Hydrogen and fuel cells.

http://www.humboldt.edu/~serc/h2fuel.html

Link

37 posted on 01/09/2002 5:54:48 PM PST by CIB-173RDABN
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To: John Jamieson
Exactly, but you see the function of government is to prevent breakthrough technology in the name of pursuing it, not actually break through to better energy sources.
44 posted on 01/09/2002 6:30:36 PM PST by AmericanVictory
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To: John Jamieson
This is just a Bush administration gift to their oil industry friends. Hydrogen powered cars in sufficient numbers are at least decades away. And you still need energy to produce the hydrogen if hydrolysis is used.

The first rule the administration could and should make, by fiat, is to stop exempting light trucks and vans from the CAFE requirements. The average miles per gallon of all vehicles on the road would pretty quickly rise by a considerable fraction, perhaps 15-20%.

45 posted on 01/09/2002 6:33:48 PM PST by Magician
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To: John Jamieson
Oh, boy, the compassionate conservative strikes again in another blow for "smaller" government. The era of Big Government under GWB is not only not over, it is just cranking up.

Another massive federal welfare program for the automakers to blow a bunch of money on. Basically, like a lot of other Clinton programs "conservatives" used to rail against, Bush has merely exchanged one federal boondoggle and substituted his own.

Motto of the New! GOP under Bush, Hastert and Lott.

"At least he's our thief."

58 posted on 01/09/2002 7:08:56 PM PST by Jesse
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To: John Jamieson
The socialist keep telling us we're running out of oil, but it just ain't true. They just want to bankrupt capitalism, so they can take charge. We find more reserves every year and keep finding more all the time. We find new ways to get more out of the ground, and use less thru conservation too.

More and more geologist now think that the earth is continual production of oil and we haven't even scratched the surface yet.

Look it up, there have always been an increasing amount of reserves over previous years, and the projected shortage is always a few years ahead, and based on zero new discovery.

Read this

67 posted on 01/09/2002 8:26:20 PM PST by PeaceBeWithYou
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To: John Jamieson

” The Bush administration launched a partnership today with domestic automakers to spur the growth of hydrogen fuel cells for the next generation of cars and trucks,...”

And 18 years later that taxpayer money has produced... nothing.


72 posted on 12/19/2020 9:39:18 PM PST by mrsmith (US MEDIA: " Every 'White' cop is a criminal! And all the 'non-white' criminals saints!")
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