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1 posted on 08/10/2002 10:54:19 AM PDT by chance33_98
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To: jwalsh07; Inkie; rdb3; JavaTheHutt; packrat35; cake_crumb; Mad Dawgg; mafree; 11B3; OKSooner; ...
PING!
2 posted on 08/10/2002 11:00:19 AM PDT by chance33_98
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To: chance33_98
the judge is tinkering with subjective rules and calling them unconstitutional because he considers them to be unfair. But the entire concept of throwing a parent in jail who merely doesn't have the amount of money the state says he owes should be declared unconstitutional. You can't afford to pay your debts, so you are taken to jail, this should be considered beyond the power of the law, it is debtor's prison.
4 posted on 08/10/2002 11:33:59 AM PDT by Red Jones
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To: chance33_98
Child support systems aren't only unconstitutional, they're criminal fraud. Bear in mind that as far as I'm concerned, fathers who don't support their children are the scum of the earth who should be shunned like they had the plague. On the other hand, the whole process of child support enforcement comes about when the mother goes to the state to collect some form of public assistance that there is no constitutional authority for in the first place. The state then comes after the father civilly to collect a debt it never had the authority to create in the first place!

Notice that the entire step of the mother civilly suing the father for support is bypassed and rather than the mother being the party at interest, the state is now the party at interest. The state says "We created an unconstitutional wealth re-distribution scheme and now we're going to force YOU to pay for it at the point of a gun!" Sound familiar?

8 posted on 08/10/2002 1:52:52 PM PDT by agitator
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To: chance33_98
About time !

A lot of what child support units have been doing is (to say the least) questionable. For instance:

In NJ, Welfare Boards ( which, in that state, are allowed to file child support actions on behalf of support recipients ) were filing against the "absent parent" (99.99% Male) in situations wherein welfare benefits had been paid out, but the parents had patched up their quarrels and re-united before an order for support had been entered. They were doing this as a matter of policy , rather than a matter of law, and they were hauling the reconciled fathers into court to enforce re-payment orders the court had never seen.

Finally, one father, who had enough money for a good lawyer,challenged the system..and won. Soon after that,several hundred illegal "orders" were abruptly set aside.

Generally speaking, I've noticed, unless the defendat has a lawyer with clout,the Family Court judges will go along with almost anything Welfare and/or the Support Collection agencies suggest.

12 posted on 08/10/2002 4:37:54 PM PDT by genefromjersey
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To: chance33_98
I thought we were supposed to report people who talked about the Constitution to the FBI?

You mean we're still using Constitutions!?

What is this strange place called Tennessee.

19 posted on 08/10/2002 8:23:43 PM PDT by AdamSelene235
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To: JimKalb; Free the USA; EdReform; realwoman; Harrison Bergeron; Orangedog; Lorianne; Outlaw76; ...
New bump list
27 posted on 08/13/2002 6:48:48 AM PDT by RogerFGay
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To: chance33_98; JimKalb; Free the USA; EdReform; realwoman; Harrison Bergeron; Orangedog; Lorianne; ...
SOURCE

Despite an appeals court ruling overturning state guidelines for calculating child support, the Department of Human Services is "of the opinion" the current rules are in effect until the issue is settled by the Tennessee Supreme Court.

The state Court of Appeals in recent months has twice struck down state child support rules as unconstitutional because they fail to consider a parent's obligation to all of his or her children when setting support for children of another relationship.

The ruling in a Knoxville case in January is on appeal to the Supreme Court. That case is almost identical to one from Shelby County that was ruled unconstitutional last week.

Though he said he would not tell courts what to do, "It is our opinion that the guidelines are still in effect, pending the ruling of the Supreme Court,'' said William Russell, general counsel for the Tennessee Department of Human Services in Nashville.

The ruling last week involved a Memphis man who said the costs of raising two children in his marriage should be considered when setting payments for the support of a child from a previous relationship.

The guidelines, which have been in effect since the late 1980s, do not allow consideration of children other than those in the support order.

The latest ruling brought a wait-and-see response from Juvenile Court.

"Really, there is no change until the Supreme Court rules on the Eastern District case that is now on appeal,'' said Mitch Morgan, director of child support at Juvenile Court.

Meanwhile, Morgan said the court was fielding calls Monday from parents who wanted to know if their child support obligations would be affected.

Morgan and others said the impact could be considerable if the Supreme Court agrees the guidelines are unconstitutional.

"There are lots of cases where children are born and an order is set, and the obligor remarries and has other children who are under no court order,'' Russell said. "So he may have two or three sets of children, and it could cause everybody to have to go back and reconsider. If the Supreme Court sides with (the two cases) then I think you would see a lot of petitions to modify.''

Local lawyers who handle such cases applauded the rulings.

"I think this ruling is long overdue,'' said David Caywood. "Ever since this issue first arose I have taken the position that it was unconstitutional to place some children in the first-class section of an airplane and the other children back in coach.

"That is exactly what has happened. These children have nothing to do about the progression in which they were born, nor whether they were born into a conventional family or unconventional family.''

Fellow attorney Kay Farese Turner agreed.

"What happened under Tennessee child support guidelines is that it treated after-born children unequally,'' she said.

She said there are a number of significant inequities in current child support guidelines, some of which end up with a noncustodial parent paying unrealistic sums for child support.

Gail Sevier, the attorney who represented the plaintiff in the case in Friday's appeals court ruling, said there is debate among lawyers about how child support should be calculated, since the appeals court "didn't give any guidance on that.''

She said that technically, Juvenile, Circuit and Chancery courts could go ahead and modify cases now, but many probably will wait for the Supreme Court to rule.

- Shirley Downing:
35 posted on 08/14/2002 7:07:27 AM PDT by RogerFGay
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