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California: Poll: Bush winning over Latino voters
The Sacramento Bee ^ | August 21, 2002 | Muriel Dobbin -- Bee Washington Bureau

Posted on 08/21/2002 6:39:58 PM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach

Edited on 04/12/2004 5:42:00 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

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To: PuNcH
Don't be a jerk. First, until LAST YEAR, every summer my family would live for anywhere from six weeks to three months in Phoenix. My mother lives there year round, as do all my friends.

Before you post again, get evidence. Take my little test.

You seem to be missing the point, though. It isn't a "race" thing as you and jody want to make it. I'm making a cultural point: Americans ("white," "middle and upper class minorities of all sorts") view many of the jobs that were once considered good careers as "scut work." This is validated in poll after poll, in business school survey after business school survey. When I say Americans ("whites") WON'T do these jobs, I mean that culturally these jobs have been viewed in the last 30 years as "undesirable" and not profitable---even when, as with some doormen in NYC and baggage check guys at the airports---they pay VERY well. SERVICE, as a concept (leaving aside insurance, banking, and accounting-type "services") is now viewed with disdain.

Employers---and, please, talk to any---know that even paying $10-20 an hour often will not get educated, motivated, skilled people in what are considered "degrading jobs." I once had an ARIZONA milionaire, who made his fortune in garbage collection, tell me how hard it was to get employees, even though he paid very well and "there is a lot of money in sh*t."

It is under these conditions that most Americans---and I venture to say a large majority of whites---refuse to do these jobs except as a total last resort, and it is why illegals fill them in overwhelming numbers. Have you not heard spokesmen for the restaurant industry in the West say that if not for illegals, they would ALL be broke? I have.

381 posted on 08/24/2002 7:33:27 AM PDT by LS
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To: RLK
I posted facts which you have yet to address.

So, who is denying?

The facts posted clearly state that the wolrd population is in a rapid decline.

You continue to attack me, and leave my facts unchallenged.

That's indicative of a defeated debater.

382 posted on 08/24/2002 8:30:13 AM PDT by Luis Gonzalez
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To: Luis Gonzalez
The facts posted clearly state that the wolrd population is in a rapid decline.

-------------------------------

What the hell does a managed decrease in the population of China have to do with the documented gain in Mexico?

383 posted on 08/24/2002 12:43:30 PM PDT by RLK
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To: RLK
As I thought, you didn't bother reading the article at all.

It clearly shows what a dishonest debater you are.

Stick a fork in you, you're done.
384 posted on 08/24/2002 6:04:59 PM PDT by Luis Gonzalez
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To: Luis Gonzalez
I have no idea to what you are referring beyond the fact you don't like my position.
385 posted on 08/24/2002 7:34:37 PM PDT by RLK
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To: Tancredo Fan; 4Freedom; madfly
I will not be a Bush/Mexican republican. I'll find someone else to vote for. I don't know who, but anybody but Bush!!
386 posted on 08/25/2002 4:37:11 PM PDT by Brownie74
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To: Brownie74
It's hard to feel any other way about Bush. In spite of all the faxes, letters and phone calls that the Republicans received, against an extension of the 245i amnesty for illegal immigrants, the Republican Party still wants to pretend that immigration isn't an issue.

They've mailed out a questionnaire that doesn't even ask what Republican voters think about immigration.

Well I guess they believe they can claim that passing an amnesty for illegal aliens, allowing out of control, massive, legal immigration and leaving our borders wide open isn't against the will of their constituents, if they don't make themselves officially aware of the will of their constituents.

Bush and the Republican Party are committing political suicide.

If you receive a package of grape Kool-Aide in the mail, from the Republican Party, forward it on to Capitol Hill.

Washington D.C. = 'Jone's town II'! ;^)

387 posted on 08/26/2002 1:59:31 AM PDT by 4Freedom
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To: Brownie74; Luis Gonzalez; RLK
I will not be a Bush/Mexican republican. I'll find someone else to vote for. I don't know who, but anybody but Bush!!

Al Gore thanks you for your vote. You did say anybody.

388 posted on 08/26/2002 2:17:38 AM PDT by Dane
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To: Brownie74; Luis Gonzalez; RLK
Whoops the last part of reply #388 was left out.

Brownie how come you seem to print hysterical rants, after a person on your side is thoroughly defeated.(Luis vs. RLK earlier in this subset of replies)

Oh that's right gotta get that red meat out there to dull the stinging pain.

389 posted on 08/26/2002 2:24:37 AM PDT by Dane
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To: Brownie74; RLK
My personal recommendation would be to ignore what appear to be deliberate attempts to bait you two into a flame war, with non-substantive remarks and false declarations of victory.

The idea of victory is judged by some as the ability to form a complete sentence no matter how deliberate an attempt at obfuscation it is.

We know it's the low wages and not the manual labor. Everybody does.

Competition for menial jobs from illegal immigrants, that will take any job they can get, for less than what an American is willing to work for, in neighborhoods that only the desperate will enter, is the problem.

Somebody said Americans won't work as skycaps. That's a crock. Try and get a $200,000 a year skycap job (What investigative reporters in Chicago have surmised.) at O'Hare International Airport without huge political connections or major payoffs.

There are former airline pilots and I believe airport managers working those jobs.

One job I had, while I was in college, was as a banquet bartender at a major hotel. It was great. The banquet manager was flexible. We could always work out scheduling conflicts. The full-timers were cool.

Then, that manager simply vanishes one day. No explanation, nothing. An Iranian immigrant is in his place and the shedule becomes chiseled in stone. If you don't like it, there's the door.

The new banquet manager knew we weren't going to drop out of college to keep the job. It was either that or leave.

Everyone that left was replaced by a Middle-Easterner. Every single one.

That's how some of these decent paying jobs become jobs that Americans just won't do anymore.

Go apply for the doorman's job at a major hotel. Anyone that says you can get that job just by walking in off the street is crazy. You have to be willing to do other hotel jobs for squat and hope to live long enough for one of those doormen to die and a whole succession of others, that are in line for that job ahead of you, to follow him to the grave.

Almost nobody retires from that job. They work it until they literally die, the money's so good. Unless the hotel ownership changes and scheduling conflicts suddenly arise in every department. ;^)

There's been threads about the threats, intimidation, vandalism and violence against employees at Tyson chicken plants. The Americans that left their jobs under duress were replaced by, aw go on and guess.

These guys, you're arguing with, know these things better than you do. They know the score out there, but they'll try and get your goat just the same.

My advice is to move on to another thread. The only ones paying any attention to this thread anymore are you and the agitators.

390 posted on 08/26/2002 6:09:45 AM PDT by 4Freedom
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To: 4Freedom
You're right.

They're like unruly dumb high school kids baiting the teachers. The problem is, there are so many of them and they are ultimately responsible for putting people such as the Clintons in office and destroying this nation.

391 posted on 08/26/2002 10:19:12 AM PDT by RLK
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To: Common Tator; mhking; swheats; Trueblackman; mafree; T Lady; Sabertooth
You spoke the truth in #13. Both my mother and father were once Republicans before the Civil Rights movement got into full swing.

When you said, "It was all cosmetics and image.. and next to no action," that's exactly right. Plus one phone call to MLK from Kennedy while King was in jail.

Pure symbolism over substance.

As I go down this thread, I had a thought in mind that proved to be true. I had thought that if a thread were created that said Bush's popularity and approval numbers go up from a minority element, folks here would squawk loudly.

I was right.

It appears that since some here believe that blacks and Hispanics can in no way support a Pub without some negative overall "cost" to the nation. It also appears that some here would want to ensure that the Right remains all white.

That, too, is the truth. But I have news for such people: IT AIN'T HAPPENING.

392 posted on 08/26/2002 10:30:51 AM PDT by rdb3
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To: rdb3
I see what you were saying. Some of the posts were rather breathtaking...sort of like some of the garbage the Race Hustlers were spewing at the (Un)Millions For Reparations March August 17th.

I also remember when Mr.Bush was inagurated, he said that he was the President of ALL OF THE PEOPLE.

Great point well taken.
393 posted on 08/26/2002 10:56:00 AM PDT by T Lady
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To: rdb3
Bump- wassup??
394 posted on 08/26/2002 11:30:32 AM PDT by mafree
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To: Dane
You did say anybody.

I didn't say anybody - I said someone. There's a difference ya know.

Where have you been old hoss? I haven't had the pleasure of chatting with you in a long time. Have you completed your liberal 12 step program yet? I guess not judging from your post.

Hang in there ol' son - it get easier once you get past the 6th step.

395 posted on 08/26/2002 12:12:22 PM PDT by Brownie74
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To: 4Freedom
If you receive a package of grape Kool-Aide in the mail, from the Republican Party, forward it on to Capitol Hill.

Why waste good Kool-Aide by forwarding it to Capitol Hill. There is nobody up there that's got enough sense to mix it with water. Even if they figured out how to make it they couldn't pour it out of the pitcher unless the directions were written on the bottom of the pitcher.

I'll keep my Kool-Aide!!

396 posted on 08/26/2002 12:29:47 PM PDT by Brownie74
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To: rdb3
It also appears that some here would want to ensure that the Right remains all white.

That, too, is the truth. But I have news for such people: IT AIN'T HAPPENING.

I'll second that.

The appeal of conservatism has nothing to do with being Caucasian or anything else. Its appeal is that it seeks the truth and promotes individual freedom in the freest nation there ever has been.




397 posted on 08/26/2002 4:08:42 PM PDT by Sabertooth
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