Posted on 06/13/2003 8:17:51 AM PDT by kattracks
Here it is!
I'm looking forward too it. Eagerly awaiting hearing God say "Well done, my good and faithful servant"
Fortunately I believe the way He believes and His opinion is the only one that counts.
Of course engaging in any behavior is a choice. It's the attraction you have no control over.
Kleptomaniacs can overcome their disease, compulsive overeaters can overcome their disease, victims of violence can overcome their mental injuries. Any mental illness or trauma (such as Same-sex Attraction Disorder) can be overcome. Even some diseases that (unlike SAD) have a proven genetic component like alcoholism can be overcome.
We control our feelings. They don't control us. (except of course in the case of the "it's OK to be gay" crowd, who've given up control of themselves)
Well here's your problem. Bigotry is not evil. If fact God commands us to hate evil (such as homosexual behavior or murder or child molesting). If God commands us to be bigots on some issues then how can bigotry be evil?
Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they are evil bigots. Especially when they are right.
Your God is the biggest bigot you know of. Your God who was created in your image and likeness. Your God who killed all the first born of a nation. Your God who killed everyone on earth except for one family. Your God who ordered some poor guy to kill his own son. Your God who gives you his ok to drag blacks and homosexuals behind your pickup trucks.
Congratulations on your creation.
Japan has long accepted male homosexuality. It was an integral part of Japanese culture throughout the Samurai eras. The tradition of male on male love was greatly encouraged within the samurai class. It was considered useful to boys in teaching them virtue, honesty and the appreciation of beauty. While at the same time the love of women was often devalued for its so called 'feminising' effect. The arrival of Christians in Japan forced the open acceptance of homosexuality into "the silence." Everyone knew it existed but did not talk about it (as is true of many things in Japan). Now that the Christian influence in Japan is deminishing, the homosexual culture in Japan is re-emerging as converstaion in polite society.
As far as female homosexuality is concerned, you are correct. The only possible extant female homosexual society to be found today is ironically among the Catholic female religous orders.
Just in case you were curious, the first books of the Bible are over 3500 years old. I know that John O. displays a lot of wisdom, but I don't think he is that old.
You may believe you have the right to judge G-d out of all of your wisdom and knowledge, but I don't recommend it.
Shalom.
Thank you, that is news to me. I will look into it.
For what it's worth, I doubt I would put pre-Christian Japan into the list of nations I would like to emulate any more than Sparta. But it is new information and I need to look into it more carefully.
You see, this is one of the ways we judge truth claims - we look at the results they predict and the results we see. One of the beauties of Judaism and Christianity is that their truth claims are public - a part of the historical record.
One of those claims is that following the abominations listed by G-d actually destroys a society. His words were "the land will vomit you out." And that's what has happened to any nation that has followed those abominations.
Actually, as someone will soon tell me, every civilization has passed. I will respond that every civilization but one has passed. One civilization survived 2000 years of the worst attempts that every government in the world could throw at it to eradicate it. It waited until it could have a homeland again, then re-emerged in nearly the same form as it had been when the most attempt to destroy it began.
I'm sure you know, that civilization survivied 2000 years in hostile territory because it relied on G-d's commandments.
Those commandments were not given to us to hurt us, but to protect us. They are the same kind of commandments that parents give to their children when they say, "Look both ways before crossing the street." They are the same kinds of commandments that the nation gives to drivers when it establishes rules of the road. If drivers didn't obey rules of the road, driving would be either deadly or impossible.
G-d's commandments are a blessing and a delight. Those who look at them otherwise believe they know more than G-d.
That is a foolish notion.
Shalom.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/2002-07-15-church-gay_x.htm
Why? Are you not reading them?
Well, you and I will have to disagree on this. Maybe you should ask around, find out how many of your straight male friends fantasize about sex with men. Get back to me.
So you feel that there are reasons other than sexual gratification that people engage in fisting?
"I would have a problem with a conference about sex containing information about peeing on your partner."
You have a problem with private conferences where they would discuss something like that? Why? You don't have to attend.
"I understand some people link this to sexual activity, but it isn't sex."
No, it isn't SEX... but the conference was sexual in nature. No one thought it would be a discussion at length about the missionary position.
"And obviously a lot of people agree with me, because the best defense GLSEN can mount was, "Hey! Nobody was supposed to know what we were talking about." "
Yeah.. a lot of people agree with you who didn't attend the conference, don't agree with the premise of it, and WOULDN'T attend such a conference.. except for the guys there who only attended to make a stink about it.
I'm sure they would. Why did they want to become ex-gays?
"But you need to believe that you are what you are and cannot change, mostly because you don't want to take responsibility for your behavior."
I'm taking full responsibility for my behavior. If I could change, I wouldn't. I don't want to change, I enjoy my life the way it is. I feel no guilt, and don't believe I should. Why would I desire change?
"So convince yourself they are lying."
I'm not convinced they're lying, but I am sure they lived some pretty wretched lives. I'm glad I am not them.
I don't know what verses you grabbed these from. They're not in my bible. What's the problem with the others?
Why don't you ever say that when people on the threads are talking about the extremely screwed up lesbian they met?
"Just because you feel something you do naturally does not make it right or good."
On the other hand, what if it's not wrong or bad?
"Homosex is a cancerous evil that destroys, first the individual, then the society which tolerates it."
I'll let you know when I'm destroyed. As for society, while I'm sure it's convenient to blame homosexuality for the destruction of society, there isn't any proof that such a small number of people are capable of such a thing.
"You might argue that you don't feel you're being destroyed. But then you would have to remember that most people don't have any symptoms of cancer"
What sort of destruction do you think homosexuality leads to?
Silly analogy. If you wanted to say that heterosexuals can remain virgins, then you might be on to something.
"We control our feelings. They don't control us."
There is no point in controlling feelings that aren't wrong.
I guess your bible is not the common Judeo-Christian bible.
For your reading pleasure: Exodus 12:1-14 RSV
We have the right to be mentally ill in this country. That doesn't make the statements invalid, they must be viewed in context. They could have just as well started with their right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. One cannot responsibly consider that statement outside of the context with which it is declared.
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