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Couple lose their home over $120 debt
The Sacramento Bee ^ | January 24, 2004 | Michael Kolber -- Bee Staff Writer

Posted on 01/25/2004 5:49:41 AM PST by DelaWhere

Edited on 04/12/2004 6:04:31 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

Couple lose their home over $120 debt By Michael Kolber -- Bee Staff Writer Published 2:15 a.m. PST Saturday, January 24, 2004 Get weekday updates of Sacramento Bee headlines and breaking news. Sign up here.

COPPEROPOLIS -- A retired couple's dispute with their homeowners association has spiraled out of control in this Calaveras County community -- and now they have lost their home less than a year after failing to pay $120 in annual dues.


(Excerpt) Read more at sacbee.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events; US: California
KEYWORDS: abuse; association; constitution; homeowner; property; propertyrights; radcliff; rights
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To: PackerBoy
It is interesting to me that this conservative forum produces so much liberal-sounding sympathy.

It sounds like you don't understand what a conservative is. What exactly are you suggesting the conservative position would be in a situation like this?

Be careful with your answer, I am your stereotypical evil land baron with a company store and poor saps paying me rent for broken down shacks. I might just follow your suggestion.

141 posted on 01/25/2004 7:28:07 AM PST by BJungNan
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To: ovrtaxt
"Seems to me the right to life, liberty and property trumps EVERYTHING else."

I think you are referring to one of the phrases in Amendment V, U.S. Constitution to make your contention stated above.

Your contention is incorrect for two reasons:

One, the correct version of Amendment V is "...nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law;" The Radcliff's were afforded the "due process of law."

Two, the Constitution only applies to government entitities. It has no jurisdiction within a private contract.

An HOA is private organization that the Radcliff's were a member of just becasue they were a propery owner. You have no constitutionally enumerated rights to be allowed or protected within a private organization.

More than likely when they signed the contract to purchase their home, they also signed an affadavit acknowledging receipt of the HOA rules, explaining to them what would happen to them if they became in arrears on their association fees.

The Radcliff's also probably had an opportunity to attend annual or semi-annual association meetings in which board members were nominated and elected. As with most HOA's, very few members attend these meetings and subsequently are surprised by the HOA's actions, when, due to their laziness or negligence, fail to attend the annual or semi-annual meetings when board members are elected and when rule changes are suggested and enacted.

It is easy to call the board members who foreclosed on the Radcliff's Nazi's, but they were doing the job that the other HOA members had elected them to do.

Quite, simply this entire matter is nothing more than basic contract law.

The Radcliff's are adults. They entered into a contract and failed to keep up their side of the contract agreement.

Fortunately, here in my home state of Missouri, the Missouri Constitution states, Article I, Section 13, "That no ex post facto law, nor law impairing the obligation of contracts, or retrospective in its operation, or making any irrevocable grant of special privileges or immunities, can be enacted."

142 posted on 01/25/2004 7:31:07 AM PST by tahiti
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To: PackerBoy
Not even a little bit, sorry.

Okay, I'll count you among those who's fairness gland is malfunctioning. :o)

They were behind in their taxes, too,

Income taxes. The IRS very rarely does home foreclosures for that.

143 posted on 01/25/2004 7:32:58 AM PST by Lazamataz (The Republicans have turned into Democrats, and the Democrats have turned into Marxists.)
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To: buffyt
I can't believe anyone would want to live on her street and be unable to have a campaign sign in the yard

Till your neighbor becomes an antiwar demonstrator, the guy down the street is into Gay rights, and the sign you see out your bedroom window calls Bush a Nazi. A neighborhood awash in signs.

Large pieces of property where you can't see your neighbors are desirable. But for those who live in small-lot developments close together, most have chosen to self-regulate to protect their investment through covanents and HOAs.

144 posted on 01/25/2004 7:34:03 AM PST by HairOfTheDog
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To: Lazamataz
Now I kill every spider I see.

I never seen one (Brown Recluse), they must hide real well is all I can say. On the other hand, We have lots of black widows here around and under rocks.

Have took time to show them to my boys for their safty.

145 posted on 01/25/2004 7:37:56 AM PST by LowOiL (Christian and proud of it !)
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To: DelaWhere
I would also assume that the tax obligation fell into the same situation.

Tax sale in California can't occur unless the property taxes are five years in arrears.

146 posted on 01/25/2004 7:38:26 AM PST by RGSpincich
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To: sauropod
Perhaps he just wants his money back, which is reasonable enough?

I'm wondering how $120 became almost $2,000 in less than a year. For $2,000 in charges couldn't someone have called these people and told them they needed to pay their fees and lose the home?

I'm sure that if someone had walked up to their house and explained the situation, the couple would have found a way to get the $120.

It's not the buyer's fault, it's the association's, and I think the association should be liable for a loss that's looking pretty grim if the house was worth $250k.

D
147 posted on 01/25/2004 7:45:30 AM PST by daviddennis (;)
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To: TN4Liberty
I understand this sentiment. But from a business perspective, SOMEBODY was going to buy this house for $70,000.

I disagree. From a business perspective, SOMEBODY was going to bid $75,000 before the gavel fell, with a $258,000 home on the auction block. And after that, somebody was going to bid $80,000, and so on. It wouldn't have made it to $258,000, of course--who would pay full price when the home is in such a totalitarian neighborhood--but $70,000 sounds like a backroom deal to me.

The owners should have paid the $120. Having failed in that, they seem to be on the hook for almost two grand. But having their home sold out from under them for less than a third of its worth? Someone was out to hurt them badly.

148 posted on 01/25/2004 7:48:25 AM PST by Physicist (Sophie Rhiannon Sterner, born 1/19/2004: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1061267/posts)
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To: Cowboy Bob
Exactly! I'd like to see his relationship to ANY member of that board...
149 posted on 01/25/2004 7:50:39 AM PST by pamlet
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To: PackerBoy
The homeowners are the victims...When are the liberals, like Sen. Boxer and her ilk going to pass enough laws to protect us all from our stupidity! Dumbed-down minds want to know.













150 posted on 01/25/2004 7:54:14 AM PST by Sandmansleeper (Quinn's First Law: Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent)
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To: LowOiL
I never seen one (Brown Recluse), they must hide real well is all I can say.

There's a reason they call 'em "brown recluse" :)

Nasty things - I came within an eyelash of having one drop onto my chin once when I was crawling under a stage laying power cables for lighting.

151 posted on 01/25/2004 7:56:33 AM PST by Johnny_Cipher (Miserable failure = http://www.michaelmoore.com/ sounds good to me!)
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To: Physicist
but $70,000 sounds like a backroom deal to me.

Deeds of Trust are foreclosed on on the courthouse steps. All bidding occurs in the wide open. Check it out

152 posted on 01/25/2004 7:57:05 AM PST by RGSpincich
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To: DelaWhere
Get used to it. The personal debt of the average american family is about to hit the fan. It will not be pretty.
153 posted on 01/25/2004 7:57:52 AM PST by joyful1
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To: Lazamataz
Some HOA's are benign.
And so are some tumors, but I don't want either!
Jack
154 posted on 01/25/2004 8:00:50 AM PST by btcusn
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To: John Jorsett
If you don't want to be subject to HOA rules, don't live in a home where there is one.

This is very true. Today though that really limits you to places that were built more than 20 years ago. The American Planning Association has long encouraged local governments to REQUIRE all new developments have HOA's. Why? Because they, as private entities, can enforce rules that in most states government is not permitted to. Generally, local government can tell you have to shovel your sidewalk (as a safety thing), but not that your car must be parked in the garage; that you have to mow your lawn (to control noxious weeds), but not that you have to paint your house. In their pursuit of Utopian communities that look perfect, the APA is giving our local governments all the information they need to get these kinds of rules in place through a third party - the HOA.

155 posted on 01/25/2004 8:08:14 AM PST by Kay Ludlow
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To: KC Burke
BUMP!

It appears that, to many of the so called 'conservatives' of FR, the rule of law is only important when Bill Clinton is in violation. When the so called 'conservatives' violate the law (like a contract they willingly signed), the rule of law seems to be, to them, optional.
156 posted on 01/25/2004 8:11:34 AM PST by jimkress (Save America from the tyranny of Republican/Democrat hegemony. Support the Constitution Party.)
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To: Nathaniel Fischer
Meanwhile, a family is destroyed.
157 posted on 01/25/2004 8:13:52 AM PST by sauropod (What happens at CPAC stays at CPAC)
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To: PackerBoy
If the homeowners agreed to abide by the association's rules, were properly assessed $120 in charges, failed/refused to pay them, ignored a dozen collection letters, and failed to come up with the case when they were sued -- what is wrong with legal process taking its course, even if the result seems tragic?

Abiding by the agreement is the right thing to do, but there's another essential question here.

How did HOA's get this much power? Because our local governments are REQUIRING HOA's, often with very restrictive rules, as a condition of development. If you don't agree to form the HOA, your development will not be approved. In our area, I know for a fact the paid planning staff provides developers with the proposed HOA rules. The developer can make changes, but the planning staff better agree with them. HOA's are a surrogate for government, requiring restrictions and 'taxes' (dues) that government is not permitted to require.

158 posted on 01/25/2004 8:14:19 AM PST by Kay Ludlow
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To: Orangedog
You speak truth.
159 posted on 01/25/2004 8:16:00 AM PST by sauropod (What happens at CPAC stays at CPAC)
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To: ovrtaxt; Noumenon
Correct. America is moving toward a flash point. Just hard to predict exactly when this will be. Too many people don't care until its their ox being gored.
160 posted on 01/25/2004 8:19:48 AM PST by sauropod (What happens at CPAC stays at CPAC)
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