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To: ninenot; sittnick; steve50; Hegemony Cricket; Cicero; GarySpFc; Wolfie; ex-snook; FITZ; arete; ...
Contributions from immigrant cultures modified and enriched the Anglo-Protestant culture of the founding settlers. The essentials of that founding culture remained the bedrock of U.S. identity, however, at least until the last decades of the 20th century. Would the United States be the country that it has been and that it largely remains today if it had been settled in the 17th and 18th centuries not by British Protestants but by French, Spanish, or Portuguese Catholics? The answer is clearly no. It would not be the United States; it would be Quebec, Mexico, or Brazil.

Important text!

90 posted on 12/26/2006 5:55:45 AM PST by A. Pole (Innocence is like a dumb leper who has lost his bell, wandering the world, meaning no harm.)
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To: A. Pole

Excellent article. Thanks for the ping.

Whether one believes that we are in immediate danger from Mexican immigration or not, it would be a grave mistake not to acknowledge that there are those who do absolutely believe this. And if this issue is allowed to fester without being addressed, it will surely bring far less level heads out of the woodwork to deal with it.

Huntington cites Bosnia as something that "could happen", but says that it is doubtful that it "will happen here". Unlike him, I am not so sure of that -- both due to misperceptions about what really happened in Bosnia, and also due to an underestimation of the level of fear that can be generated in even ordinary Americans when they feel that their homes and their way of life are threatened. And it only takes a few defining incidents to shape the nightmare. Look at what 9/11 (loss of life, less than 3,000) did to the psyches of millions (perhaps even billions) of people. It can be shocking to see what ordinary people can do to one another, when they are collectively terrified. And at that point, even level heads become radicalized because there is no room for equivocating or dialogue once imagination starts running wild.


92 posted on 12/26/2006 8:15:52 AM PST by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: A. Pole; Cacique
HUNTINGTON: Such a transformation would not only revolutionize the United States, but it would also have serious consequences for Hispanics, who will be in the United States but not of it. Sosa ends his book, The Americano Dream, with encouragement for aspiring Hispanic entrepreneurs. “The Americano dream?” he asks. “It exists, it is realistic, and it is there for all of us to share.” Sosa is wrong. There is no Americano dream. There is only the American dream created by an Anglo-Protestant society. Mexican Americans will share in that dream and in that society only if they dream in English.

HUMINT: How could anyone dictate anyone else's dream? They can't! If a person conceives of an Americano Dream, then it exists. An Americano Dream doesn't devalue Huntington's American Dream or my American Dream or your American Dream. I have to respectfully disagree with Huntington who I will now refer to as a "dream killer". Let's play a game called flip the context - Ask yourself; what does a Christmas tree have to do with Jesus Christ? Decorating the tree is a convergence of several cultures into something beautiful. The custom would've been impossible to imagine for a "dream killer" like Huntington. Analytically speaking Huntington's intuitive commentary is a self fulfilling prophecy. If you look at an American and arbitrarily disqualify him or her as a potential compatriot, besides being an asshole, you're probably arbitrary yourself. Ideas are not language dependent constructs. IMO The Declaration of Independence, U.S. Constitution, Bill of Rights, Emancipation Proclamation and every other important American document should be written in every language ever conceived by the mind of mankind, printed at tax payer expense and the books should find there way onto the shelves of every office, library and home in the world. That's a dream to behold! IMO The most quoted man in the World should be Thomas Jefferson! But that too is a dream worthy of execution by Huntington's sociopathic conclusion. His forth coming book, "Who Are We?" might be better titled, "Who We Were!" because Huntington certainly cannot figure out "Who We Will Be!". Irrespective of Huntington's problematic conclusion, the problem he points out is very real.

To my mind, the influx of legal and illegal immigrants is a serious problem only if integration into America's dynamic culture is impossible. History shows that it's possible for people to integrate from virtually anywhere to virtually anywhere. Therefore the problem he outlines is solvable. Right now, there are points of failure in the process of integration. That's the primary problem. At this moment, it is difficult for anyone to offer a solution without good data. Hopes and dreams are important data. In fact casually dismissing an immigrant's hopes and dreams will exacerbate integration woes. One should consider hopes and dreams to be essential to evaluating the capacity of an immigrant community to successfully integrate. If the current dreams are destructive, don't murder the ones that exist, offer better ones.

97 posted on 12/26/2006 11:00:01 AM PST by humint (...err the least and endure! --- VDH)
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To: A. Pole; ninenot; sittnick; PalestrinaGal0317; Tax-chick
A. Pole: Huntington probably had ancestors who owned the Mayflower. He is very disappointed that his ethnic group is now outnumbered by most others: Poles like you? Irish or Germans or Scots or Scots-Irish (by way of Newfoundland in Canada) like me although I admit to an English grandfather who was the last nationality among my ancestors to arrive here? My English grandfather had the good sense to marry my Irish grandmother and to become Catholic long before his Anglican Church was confronted with Bishop Vicki Gene and such, as a condition of marriage. So I guess Professor Huntington would not care for him either.

Poor Huntington! Oh the horror! The Mexicans are coming! Many are actually Catholic (as are you, me, ninenot, sittnick, palestrinagal0317, and Taxchick)! Few Mexicans worship birth control, homosexuality and/or abortion (any more than do you or I or ninenot or sittnick or Taxchick)! Rum! Romanism! Rebellion!!! Lions and tigers and bears, oh my!!!!

A New York Times article a few days ago claimed that a full 39% of US Catholics are Mexican and/or Latin American right now. Given the respective birthrates among Latinos on the one hand and the rest of the Catholic population, Catholicism in the US will soon enough be majority Latino. If there is an absolutely revolutionary upsurge in traditionalism among Catholics (which would be evidenced by a dramatic birthrate increase), then that Latino majority might be postponed. Best of all would be the rise of traditionalism among ALL Catholics here in which case we US Catholics won't particularly care about our respective ancestries.

All: I wish each of you (and everyone else who is a Christian on Free Republic and in life) a happy and holy Christmas season and all the best in the coming year.

100 posted on 12/26/2006 2:11:23 PM PST by BlackElk (Dean of Discipline of the Tomas de Torquemada Gentlemen's Club)
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To: A. Pole; NYer; Clemenza

Not a fan of Catholics this Sam Huntington fella, eh???


125 posted on 12/26/2006 9:52:37 PM PST by El Conservador ("No blood for oil!"... Then don't drive, you moron!!!)
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