Have We Lost WWII Generation’s “Deep Knowledge?”

The Illinois leader ^ | 6/4/04 | Daniel K. Proft

[gg188]

One of the best posts that I've read in four years on the FreeRepublic!

I was thinking the same thing: one of the best posts I have ever read on Free Republic. I hope a lot of Freepers have the pleasure and honor of reading it.

[VOA]

She loved American soldiers. They had saved her life more than once .(just trying to
make a long story short.) She said she will never forget the kindness of American
soldiers. And still thanks God for America.

Hans Brisch, who was chancellor of higher education for Oklahoma, often
said that it was the kindness of Allied soldiers that kept him and his
mother from starving in post-war Germany.

[gg188]

...and Uday and Quesay are dead-ay..!

[IonInsights]

American Chopper.

[wolficatZ]

"For us the Hurtgen was one of the most costly, most unproductive, and most ill-advised battles that our army has ever fought."

-Gen. James Gavin, Commander, 82nd Airborne Division, 1944-1945

[Lakeside]

Well said! Not to take anything away from the great sacrifices of the Greatest Generation and all they went through during the Depression and then again WWII.

However, in addition to what you posted they were also the generation who voted in J.F.K. and L.B.J. Go figure.

[Michael121]

Wake Island inspired some. As the Marines aboard ships coming to reinforce were set on swimmming the last 100 miles or so when the ships were recalled. The Marines on Wake island stood their ground. It was also later an Island hopped by MacArthur.

It was used as a traget range for bombers. Later it was taken. There are only 5 or 6 of those men left alive today.

In every instance though as in Iraq, for every Marine killed or wounded, there were 10 "Japs" killed. On Okinawa 12,000 Marines became casualties. 120,000 Japs were killed.

A reporter with the Marines after a battle said 70 marines were casualties, We counted 700 dead "japs"

In Market Garden the American Airborne Units took all their objectives. The British Airborne Units took theirs. They were supported by British Armor that would not drive as would have Patton's 3rd to hell to support their troops. 101 and 82 men were outraged by the Brits who actually stopped for tea while their guys were being overrun at Arnheim.

Those in the Huertegen and the attrition that occured saw morale drop and saw combat vets, the old men finally break down, were used for one purpose to avoid an attack so the Germans could open the dams and flood the valley. Yet the plan to take the dams was cancelled.

We had Operation Cobra, "The Breakout" a plan that worked to get us out of the attrition of the Bocage. But in all the instances US Soldiers, Marines, and Sailors made the difference. In a free thinking Army, Navy, and Marine Corps the lowly private with a good idea is not hindered from making it up on the run.

Freedom allows for good ideas as with new tactics to take the hedgerows. Tactics in the Huertegen, In the Pacific...

The best of us did their jobs. Stood between tyranny and evil, not for themselves not for their country but for their buddy and so their kids would not have to.

There were battles lost, but freedom allowed those on the battlefield to learn from that and change. The tactics of the Germans and Japs was too rigid.

As Patton said, to Omar Bradley when told to hold off taking Trier because Ike thought Patton would need three armored divisions to take it, Patton replied,

"Well Brad I already took it with two, what do you want me to do? Give it back?"

It was the Commanders, the Generals like Patton, Bradley, Rose, Abrahms, and the Company Commanders, and Platoon leaders who let the conditions determine the course, and it was the Soldiers, the Marines, the Sailors, the Airmen who got the job done.

I salute those before, and those now who serve. Those in Iraq and Afghanistan know the truth. They know what it means. I would say with all they were not taught in schools, with the media the way it is, with liberalism and the lack of morals, these young men and women today in the US Military are the "Greatest Generation"

Not because during WWII there were 16 million men under arms, but because today I doubt we could ever reach that number. So those who wear the uniforms today must take up the slack.

[Freedom4US]

No, I think the commies were rightly afraid of such a large demographic boom of offspring of veterans. So, they pulled out all the stops to essentially destroy a generation in a lot of ways, with sex, drugs, and rock and roll. Just a theory, but it kind of fits.

[Freedom4US]

JFK was a conservative by today's standards! Read his first inaugural sometime (well, his only inaugural) and tell me it doesn't bring tears to your eyes.

LBJ might have been a SOB, but he didn't take any $%&^t, either, something that I have to respect. The 60's were something else, that much we can agree on I'm sure, at least.

[risk]

I think many from the greatest generation would agree: our new moral leadership comes from among those who served honorably in Vietnam. We can now look to our vets, men like Rick Rescorla and Aloha Ronnie, for the kind of guidance we once could only find from those who had served in WWII and Korea.

They've learned from their parents' mistakes, and they're ready to pilot our ship of state through the dangers presented by the left. The greatest generation failed to recognize the threat to our sovereignty and moral clarity that the left presented. The Vietnam vets know better...

[Just mythoughts]

"Ping list for the discussion of the politics and social aspects that directly effects Generation-X (Those born from 1965-1981) including all the spending previous generations (i.e. The Baby Boomers) are doing that Gen-X and Y will end up paying for."


As a parent of a Generation-X I offer you some unsolicited advice.

Generation-X might want to approach this subject with a bit more "respect". There is a great difference in having and keeping what one has earned and being given things not earned.

This generation seems to be focused upon what price in $$$$ you will be required to pay, because of what previous generations have laid upon you. Your generation has the advantage of knowing what is ahead of you while the previous generation did not.

Knowledge is your gift and the approach of appearing to dump "grandma" out on the street will not gain you the support you are going to need to change the "socialistic" system entrenched by the vast government bureaucracy.

Change is necessary, however, does the Generation X'ers have the wisdom required to bring about that change. I would suggest that your Generation start with the education system that promotes "free" education, "free" healthcare, etc., for all that breath oxygen.

[lawgirl]

msnbc.com on their main site today has a poll that one half of all French do not think they owe any moral debt to American due to D-Day or their liberation.

On this D-day I honor our war dead and give France the finger!

[Lakeside]

My dear Freedom, I don't need to read J.F.K.'s inaugural address---I *listened* to it! Yeah I'm that old :-)

Yes he was very eloquent but an immoral womanizer. He cannot be compared by today's standards re liberal/conservative. Though a few of his ideas could be labeled "conservative" trust me, he was liberal to the core.
His foreign policy was disastrous (Bay of Pigs fiasco just to name one) and he was totally clueless when it came to fighting a war just like most good liberals.

Now, does that remind you of a certain recent President? Two peas in a pod. The only difference is one came from wealth the other is white trash.

L.B.J. who was a fellow Texan to my eternal embarrassment. He was more than just an SOB he was a ruthless, crooked SOB. He deserves NO respect. Read the books "A Choice Not an Echo" and "None Dare Call it Treason" if they are still in print. He also didn't know how a war was to be successfully fought either sending thousands of our good, decent young men to their deaths.

Not all the Boomers were low-life protesters. There were a lot of honorable men who fought and died in Viet Nam. And I never understood why the GG didn't stand up for them against the media/communist incited protesters.

The GG elected J.F.K. largely because he looked pretty on t.v. That was deep reasoning. Not

The GG elected L.B.J. partly by sympathy vote but mostly by a propaganda t.v. add with a little girl picking daisies while an atom bomb exploded in the background. He successfully painted Goldwater as an out of control warmonger whose finger was itching to press THE button. All that was a bunch of hooey that even a child could see through but not the GG. They elected that monster L.B.J. in a landslide. Deep knowledge?

The 60's WERE something else and very painful to look back on. It was when I lost all respect for the GG. While they *should* be put on a pedestal and lauded for their sacrifices in living through the Depression and winning WWII against all odds, their naivete in certain very important arenas was astounding.

All this was to point out that every generation has had its fubar moments (yes, even yours) and none are immune to stupid actions/reactions and we all have to live with the repercussions. Don't blame the Boomers exclusively for the problems of today. The problems are an accumulation of ALL generations not just one.

[ALOHA RONNIE]

.

Perspective is as Perspecitive does..?


JOHN KERRY = Enemy of Vietnam Vets

http://www.TheAlamoFILM.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1320



Signed:.."ALOHA RONNIE" Guyer / Veteran-"WE WERE SOLDIERS" Battle of IA DRANG-1965

(Photos)
http://www.lzxray.com/guyer_set1.htm
http://www.lzxray.com/guyer_collection.htm

(Book)
'MODERN DAY HEROES: In Defense of America' - Contributing Author
http://www.ModernDayHeroes.com

.

[brushcop]

Those are excellent points you and qaml have, my wife and I have often discussed those very things, we thought we were the only ones to think that!

Isn't it strange that there is a segment of the coming-of-age late 50s, early 60s bunch, which I'm a part of, who served, raised families, stayed married. I believe you are right in pin-pointing the disconnect.

We have a heck of a generation now sacrifcing so much. My son told me of a fellow soldier, seriously wounded by RPG shrapnel in the legs and ankle during the original push to Baghdad with the 3ID. He volunteered to return when they deploy again, said that the job isn't finished yet--how 'bout that for duty, honor, country??

[wtc911]

Unknowing (how honest)...Blame the boomers for what? Almost all the legislation that shoved this country down and to the left was written, passed and signed for by GG folks. The VN war was started, run by and given up by GG politicians and generals. All the boomers did was die.

No boomers are collecting any SS retirement or medicare benefits, those are going to GGers.

Left off my earlier list of Post WW2 GG accomplishments: Castro's reign over Cuba and the Marxist warfare he sponsored in Central America, South America and Africa, the abandonment of the Iranians to the ayatollahs after decades of propping up a fascist ruler, the death of the US automobile industry and along with it the steel industry and the surrender of our supremacy in this arena to Japan (there were no Toyotas, Hondas, Datsuns, in American garages until the GG took control in Detroit), PolPot and the millions he killed, Idi amin and the millions he killed, the United Nations, hundreds of thousands of our former "allies" killed in VN after the GG politicians cut and ran.

There is such a lack of historical truth on these boomer-hating threads. The GG grew-up during the depression and experienced it as children, it was their parents who had to deal with its realities. The idol worship comes from kids who lack first hand knowledge and historical perspective. The image they worship is one gilded by both the media and the desire for what people believe to be simpler, more dignified times.

Among me and my nine siblings we have thirty children, most of them GXers. I am proud to say that there is not a whiner in the bunch.

A lot of parents from my generation messed up their kids, but guess what, these parents were raised by GGers so, since you are so eager to play the blame game, who failed whom? All those Xers in uniform, (and I know many of them through my work) were all raised by boomers. How did that happen? Cosmic accident?

I suggest that you focus on taking care of your own house without looking to throw a blanket of blame without the necessary facts, Unknowing. Maybe by the time your kids, if you ever have any, are grown no a-holes from their generation will blame you for Rap, MTV, obscene levels of teen-age pregnancies, internet kiddie porn, muslim call to prayer broadcasts in their towns, the loss of literature, the dearth of church going, the morning after pill as birth control, crack, hooking-up instead of relationships, gay families, gay studies in HS, the death of any civilized culture in America.....

Good luck kid.

[Unknowing]

"No [Baby] [B]oomers are collecting any SS retirement or medicare benefits."

No, probably not. I'm sorry, you get nothing.

There really is a cross-generational antagonism which has already gone beyond any historical basis.

It would not be right to hate the Baby Boomers, we just have to respond appropriately to their aggressions and vanities. Yea, they have already received their reward.

[wtc911]

"There really is a cross-generational antagonism which has already gone beyond any historical basis."

No, what there is is a % of kids who don't like the way the world looks and are seeking to lay the blame (like that's a new phenomenon). As I said earlier, I will brag that my kids and their twenty-five cousins, most of whom are your contemporaries, are achievers not whiners.

"I'm sorry, you get nothing."

Don't count on it. The generation that built the strongest, fastest growing economy out of the ashes left to us in the 70's/80s (19% prime rate courtesy of the GG, what is it now?) is not about to be trampled by a gaggle of whiners who wish they were their own grandparents.

As for me, I don't and won't need it. I retired before fifty. But when the dough I put in for 36 years and counting comes trickling back I will use it to travel some more, buy another car, take tango lessons or give it to my grandkids but, I will spend it, thank you.

As for you, you can spend your time hating folks who don't care enough about it to return the emotion but where's that going to get you?

To quote a great boomer scribe...."so long and thanks for all the fish."

[qam1]

Just to add a little truth to your history.....in Viet Nam the mid to senior level officers and the DOD and the politicians were "Greatest Generation". The grunts were boomers. The oldest boomer was two years shy of thirty in the year that the VN war ended (the oldest boomer now is not yet sixty, there are no Senior boomers). For almost the entire war boomers could be drafted but could not vote. (Avg EM age, 19---voting age, 21).

My quote was "and which generation can't let go of one (a war) that happened 30 years ago and sees it in every little skirmish?"

And that is not true how??

Let me add something to your history, Which generation spat on returning troops and called them "Baby Killers"?

Let a Gen-Xer do that and another Gen-Xer will slap him silly. How many articles like this one were written by Baby Boomers in 1968?

In the three wars you cite as being won the majority of mid to senior level officers and the DOD and the politicians were boomers.

The "Greatest Generation" post-war brought us Viet Nam (and the resultant damage to the military), school bussing, the immigration changes that have led us to where we are, the Great Society (aka the welfare state), Roe v. Wade (how many boomers on the bench for that one?), the decisions in media (movies, TV, music) that led to the MTV morality (or are you too unaware of the changes of the late 60s, eg via Norman Lear?) and so much more. you seem obsessed with consigning all that is vile, weak, ugly to boomers (your mommy and daddy) and all that is noble, strong and wise to the "GG" (Grandma and Grandpa).

Not at all, I do hold the Greatest Generation and their greedy ways responsible for many of the ills of today's society.

However, I can partially forgive the Greatest Generation (Not my choice of a name BTW) because

1) In defeating the Nazis and Japs at least they did something for this country.

2) Like I pointed out before they were simply in many cases just naive.

a) They probably couldn't have for seen some of the messes they created. The Baby Boomers on the other hand know full well the mess and burden they will be leaving us and not only are they not doing anything to fix or even lessen the blow they still keep (and will keep) piling on more goodies for themselves.

b) Even though they were wrongheaded in some of their policies, They never deliberately set out to undermine America and all the values that makes it great. You can not say the same thing about many of the baby boomers.

Whatever mommy and daddy did to you, I suggest you deal with it with them or on the couch, your blanket (and factually inaccurate)

Again not true at all, I have great parents even though they are boomers but I am the exception to the rule. 

condemnation of anyone born from 1946 to 1965 is tiresome and frankly, makes you appear to be whining.

I don't condem every baby boomer, There are many fine Baby Boomers like my parents, Rush Limbaugh and probably the majority boomer freepers are good people. But I'm sorry overall when you look at the baby boom generation they have already secured their place as the worst generation in American history.