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1 posted on 11/17/2004 12:10:58 PM PST by sc2_ct
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To: sc2_ct

Sounds like you did everything just right after the situation developed.

Once upon a time there was a vehicle code prohibition against 'following too closely' and your situation was a good example of why it was good. When you come to a stop in traffic, don't get so close to the vehicle in front that an emergency - fender-bustin' - departure isn't possible. That is your legally required retreat.

If you are blocked in and retreating WITH your vehicle isn't possible then retreat IN your vehicle, away from the BG so that you can properly support your weapon with two hands. When you have retreated as far as you can, when you are as pure as the driven snow in the altercation, when you are in fear of your life and the BG breaks the plane of your window - open or closed - then use sufficient force just to deliver yourself from evil. And kill the BG.

Better tried by twelve men just and true than carried by six.


26 posted on 11/17/2004 12:27:02 PM PST by dhuffman@awod.com (The conspiracy of ignorance masquerades as common sense.)
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To: sc2_ct

Prepare, plan, and be in yellow alert at all times.

I always leave a space between me and the car in front of me as an escape route just in case, and keep all doors locked at all times, obsessively.

I look rather intimidating and am ready to act intimidating if need be, i.e. loud insults, flipping bird etc. The look is my main defense and no one bothers me, ever.

Freeze plus P (tear gas) is terribly effective if need be, and a notch lower on the force continuum, if opportunity arises.

For lack of preperation you did fine tho.


29 posted on 11/17/2004 12:29:36 PM PST by Manic_Episode (OUT OF ORDER)
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To: sc2_ct

At the time you unholstered your sidearm, you had no opportunity to escape. As soon as you had the opportunity to escape, you did. I see no problem here. I also seriously doubt that this thug is the type to run to the police and tell them his version of the story. He's probably got a long rap sheet, and knows his credibility is zero.


32 posted on 11/17/2004 12:35:14 PM PST by GovernmentShrinker
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To: sc2_ct

Why would the guy be mad at you when he almost caused you to crash? Are you sure this is all there was to the incident?


33 posted on 11/17/2004 12:39:23 PM PST by MaineRepublic (Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish. -- Euripides)
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To: sc2_ct

My ex-wife was in a situation where a guy was trying to break into our house late at night during the winter in Colorado. She called the cops and told the guy she was gong to shoot if he didn’t leave. He broke his leg falling on the ice while running away. It was a nasty compound fracture and he was trying to tell the cops he was attacked by a woman with a gun. My wife asked the cop what she should have done in the situation. He replied, “You did the right thing. If he had come in after the warning, you should have shot him until the gun was empty and then thrown it at him. That way, we would have known you were in fear of your life.”


34 posted on 11/17/2004 12:39:36 PM PST by ORECON (Condi Rice/Ann Coulter - 2008)
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To: sc2_ct

OH boy....

Call Ralph Sherman in West Hartford, he is a 2nd ammendment and self defense guy

He also has a website that you can ask a question from.

I believe because you were pinned in place, pulling the weapon was just fine, but until he placed his hands on you, shooting would have been wrong.


36 posted on 11/17/2004 12:42:40 PM PST by RaceBannon (Arab Media pulled out of Fallujah; Could we get the MSM to pull out of America??)
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To: sc2_ct

I can not reply based on CT law, but OK law. Understand, I fully sympathize with you. So, don't take my answer wrong:

Rule 1: NEVER unholster a weapon unless you intend to shoot. You were smart to keep the weapon below visibility of this kook. Here if you had been seen pulling a firearm, you are guilty of assualt.

Rule 2: Deadly force (your firearm) can only be used to defend against deadly force. As scary as a yelling 250 pound thug may be. Until he actually pulls a weapon or takes actions to (in reason) immediately put you in danger of losing your life, you cannot respond with deadly force. I do not believe his level of "road rage" we meet the test. If he had of started banging on your door or attempting to break your window, or even brandishing a wrench or ballbat. Then I think you can assume he intends you serious bodily harm and can use deadly force. However, you (at least here) cannot pull a weapon as a deterent - it is assumed that when a weapon is unholstered, it is your last option and you intend to shoot. If you aren't going to shoot, don't pull the weapon.

Rule 3: If you have an avenue of retreat that won't keep you or immediate family in danger, you must use it - this you did.

Bottom line is NEVER pull a weapon unless you have a clear cut reason to immediately use deadly force.

Now, here is how I actually feel(don't do this):

I wished you had been carrying something a little for impressive in looks (a Kel-Tec is small and looks like a toy). Pulled it and stuck it in his stupid face. I think he would have immediately soiled himself.

I have never quite understood why one cannot pull a weapon as a deterent. Sometimes, just opening a jacket to let some thug know you are armed may actually save the thugs life if it causes him to run away. I guess they do not want folks using a firearm as intimidation.


37 posted on 11/17/2004 12:52:28 PM PST by Sola Veritas (Trying to speak truth - not always with the best grammar or spelling)
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To: sc2_ct

A couple of years ago, I was stopped at a stop light and a guy came up to the car and leaned into the window across my daughter. He asked if I had any money and I said no, because I didn't. I tried to find a way to get away from him but the cross traffic was so heavy and cars were going through the intersection at around 50 mph and I thought that if I tried to run the light that I would get both of us killed. I looked in the rear view mirror and I noticed that the car behind me had stopped several car lengths behind me because they could see the guy in my car. Thankfully, when I insisted that I had no money, the guy backed off.

After the terror subsided and I realized that my daughter was ok, I got angry. Yes, I should be able to take care of myself, but I wondered what happened to chivalry. My daughter and I were surrounded by men sitting in their cars and not one of them got out to see if I needed help. I know that my husband would have if he saw a woman in that situation.


38 posted on 11/17/2004 12:52:34 PM PST by SilentServiceCPOWife (In the smiling twilight of the new political morning, the unwashed told their betters to shove it.)
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To: sc2_ct
"As I was driving down the a two-lane (each way) road at 45mph, a car shot out in front of me with ..."

You're driving on a four lane divided highway at 45 mph? What was the speed limit? Were you slowing down? Was your right directional signal on?

Is it conceivable that the driver thought you were going to turn in where he was pulling out? Sounds like that was the case.

Now, this black man almost kills you by pulling out, then swerves into your lane, then flips you off, and you've got your 9mm "leetle fren", and you were "content to just sit there fuming in my car without causing an incident"?

Man, we don't have concealed carry, but that happens to me and I'm gonna be all over that guy. Flips me off? Oh brother, call 911 for me or him.

Hard to believe you didn't even give him a dirty look.

42 posted on 11/17/2004 1:00:38 PM PST by robertpaulsen
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To: sc2_ct

I can see nothing wrong with what you did other than not having a compact .45.


43 posted on 11/17/2004 1:02:29 PM PST by Tijeras_Slim (I wanna be like Squantos when I grow up.)
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To: sc2_ct
Sounds like the same guy in that area who is suing a Freeper.

You might try private mail to find out if he drives a Lexus.

45 posted on 11/17/2004 1:12:46 PM PST by bayourod (Specter's litmus test : "No Christian Judges")
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To: sc2_ct
I will second the motion for carrying some form of pepper gas. It makes a great intermediate step on the "force continuum".

Personally I carry FOX OC. I'd much rather have to paint someone like a fence with FOX to diffuse a situation than to use deadly force.

The other suggestion I would have made would be to grab a cell phone and call 911. Give the dispatcher a running account of what was going on, that way if you had used deadly force you would already be on record as to being in "reasonable fear of death or serious bodily harm".

Semper Fi
46 posted on 11/17/2004 1:12:50 PM PST by dd5339 (A sheepdog, a warrior, someone who is walking the hero's path.)
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To: sc2_ct

It sounds like you handled things pretty well.

Calling the police, like many have mentioned, is good advice.

I don't know your state laws. However avoiding a confrontation is almost always the best course of action.

Glad you weren't hurt and weren't forced to defend yourself.


55 posted on 11/17/2004 1:23:05 PM PST by untrained skeptic
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To: sc2_ct

Missed Oppurtunity , You should have shot him. ; )


64 posted on 11/17/2004 1:43:05 PM PST by Delbert
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To: sc2_ct

I had a friend that one time was stuck in traffic in Houston and had a big black guy get out of his car and cuss him right next to the drivers window side.

My friend had a sawed off 410 shot gun straped to the inside of his roof pointed to the side of the drivers side.

My friend let the guy cuss him for a while and then raised his hand and put it on the shot gun above and pointed to the big guy to take a look.

The guy looked and said to my friend "Damn man, you have yourself a nice day" and got back in his car and drove off. :)

BigMack


66 posted on 11/17/2004 1:46:57 PM PST by PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain
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To: sc2_ct
I think you did fine. Only thing I would add, along with others here, is call 911 if threatened as you were.

If you have a scanner or know somebody in dispatch, it sort of helps when you see how many calls of how many different kinds they get. An assault like this one is cert6ainly legitimate, even if you can't "make" the guy or his vehicle.

And, believe me, I get the shaking thing. I recently had to draw on a guy -- first time in my life -- who was approaching me with a club, threatening language and threatening demeanor. When he saw my pistol he got rid of the club. Conflict more or less over. But I also called 911 and, well it was a complicated incident altogether, but there's a warrant out for felony assault on the guy.

Anyway, I shook for about 4 days, and I'm still angry almost 3 weeks later.

69 posted on 11/17/2004 2:51:31 PM PST by Mad Dawg (S&W 686P, Sig - P226, P239, Beretta 92FS & 8357,Taurus snubbie, Marlin carbine in .357 magnum.)
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