Married, without children: Finding fulfillment with no kids

Rocky Mountain News ^ | 1/3/05 | Mark Wolf

[hopespringseternal]

Aren't you the salfish one.. wanting to make sure somone takes care of you in old age.

How so?

[hopespringseternal]

Other than paying for the welfare state, there is absolutely no reason that we need anything more than replacement rate fertility in this country.

Replacement rate is a nice theory, but it doesn't work in practice. How many "free will" replacement rate societies exist around the world? Societies are either expansive and limited by their environment/conditions/emigration or they are collapsing and supported by immigration.

[conservative cat]

Some people should not have children. My parents definitely shouldn't have, although I am glad to be alive.

Neither should my husband's parents. I thank God for him, but his mother especially was never prepared for what it took to have kids. She was already a bad mother while he was still in the womb.

[olivia3boys]

What a beautiful post. I'll remember it.

And you're right: you don't know love until you have a child.

[hopespringseternal]

An infinitely increasing population is a recipe for disaster. There are very real limits to water tables, arable land, and so forth. Exponential systems always crash.

Population isn't really exponential excepted in limited conditions, such as the remarkable medical advances of the past 100 years. When the average lifespan was 45 and the possible lifespan was, say 100, then an exponential jump was possible. With the possible lifespan pretty well reached, population isn't growing quite so fast.

Nor is there any real shortage of arable land. I live next to one of the largest cities in the world and arable land is being gobbled up for development simply because it is nearly worthless as arable land. By the population gloom and doomers' own numbers, we could support at least ten times the planetary population we have.

[conservative cat]

It bothers you to get a Christmas card with someone's kid on it? Seriously? I have 3 kids and sometimes send out pics, sometimes not (and usually depending on the audience) but it would never offend me if someone sent me a card with their dog or boat or even their favorite potted plant on it. I did work with someone once who gave her coworkers pictures of her kid to put on their desks. That to me was irritating.

[Aquinasfan]

but your example is of a couple who are not of the same mind, not those couples who mutually agree.

8-) That would just make the marriage doubly anullable. Usually one party is bringing the annulment. I've never heard of two people petitioning at the same time.

[Ignatz]

There is no cultural celebratory template for women who decide not to have children.

"I've thrown baby showers for girlfriends, and it's kind of this rite of passage," said Wenker. "We're going to buy you presents to get you started and treat you like Queen for a Day. It doesn't occur to anybody to celebrate a child-free woman in that way."

Geez!
Look, Wanker, er... Wenker
The Moon orbits the Earth, which in turn revolves around the Sun.
The Sun and the planets are part of a Solar System that revolves around the center of the Milky Way galaxy.
The Milky Way is part of a cluster of galaxies called the "Local Group" that revolve around a central point in the universe.
That central point is not you.
Get over it.

[A Ruckus of Dogs]

By the population gloom and doomers' own numbers, we could support at least ten times the planetary population we have.

There are various organizations, as well as studies done by our own government which say fishing stocks have markedly declined because of population growth. More people means more pollution - live in any large city to witness this. And I don't want to live on a planet that is wall to wall people.

[Muzzle_em]

My husband and I are 40 and 42, DINKS, and proudly conservative!

We both have nieces and nephews and realize that we don't want kids.

What irritates me the most about friends who have kids is that they think it is OK to bring their SPOILED child along on the rare event that we get together for dinner at a nice restaurant. The evening is always spent cleaning up the overturned drink, constantly shushing the child who insists on yelling to his mom every time she tries to hold a conversation, taking him to the bathroom 3 or 4 times during dinner, pulling him off the top of the table or out from underneath the table and chasing him around the restaurant whenever he escapes and takes off running. And we KNOW if we suggest they get a sitter, it will sound offensive to them.

[durasell]

The instruction manual is given to you by your parents over the course of your childhood. Unfortunately, many of them are filled with misprints, typos and random pages from other books. And today, there only seem to be abridged versions available. Apparently the people who produce television shows and video games have been given responsibility for raising children. So you have to see them about obtaining a copy.

[Aquinasfan]

A statistically insignificant percentage of people choosing not to have children really makes no difference to society at large.

Really? What about couples who decide to have only one child, or two? These people are of the same mindset, and their numbers are not statistically insignificant. We are now below replacement level, excluding immigrants.

[PERKY2004]

Hello Superiorslots/

My husband and I do not have any children, also by choice. We prayed about it a great deal before marrying, and decided (together) that being parents was just NOT God's call on our lives, nor did either of us want to have children. I do not believe that we are selfish or self-centered, and strive to be a blessing to others (and to be a great aunt and uncle to our 1 niece and 2 nephews). We also did not do it to save the environment (but, hey, we DO recycle!) We are staunch conservatives, evangelical christians, vote Republican, oppose abortion, and seek to help those less fortunate. My husband is active duty military, in his 22nd year of service to our nation.

We are not selfish, self-centered, or wackos becuase we have chosen not to have children. (And we did not make the decision for reasons based on career or money).

I agree with you that those who chastise or castigate us are just..... wrong.

God bless you and your wife.

[Modernman]

Societies are either expansive and limited by their environment/conditions/emigration or they are collapsing and supported by immigration.

Other than paying for welfare programs, what reason is there to grow the American population? Certainly, we should be aiming for at least replacement levels. If our native birth rate is lower than replacement level, we can make up the difference with sensible immigration policies.

However, I see no reason to grow the American population to, say, 500 million.

[Artist]

"BTW, you ignored the much more serious part of my post, and focused on the part you could slam me about. Don't think I didn't notice."

I have never understood people who care more about animals than they do other people. I never will, but I wished you well anyway. What more do you want?

[Rocky Mountain High]

This weekend, some friends and I went target shooting. Two guys brought their sons. One boy was an absolute pleasure-fun, responsible, good humored and tough. The other boy, who was younger, was a whiney brat who got in the way and ended up crying and annoying everyone else.

I don't have kids yet and my wife and I want a few, but sometimes, when I have to hang around brats, I strongly consider surgery.

In the brat's defense, though, his dad is a wus too and shouldn't have come with us either.

[HairOfTheDog]

8-) That would just make the marriage doubly anullable. Usually one party is bringing the annulment. I've never heard of two people petitioning at the same time.

But those of the same mind are not in disagreement. Annulment grounds only speaks to those seeking out, not to whether it is intrinsically wrong for couples to happily not desire children. I think there are other rules that apply to Catholics on that, but I am far from the one to find it and quote it, I am not Catholic :~D

[Aquinasfan]

Who the hell cares about college in comparison to bringing another life into the world?

Responsible people who care about their childrens' future. We have way too many people in this world who get knocked up without thinking about what kind of life they can provide their child.

Better not to exist than not to be schooled?

If I had a choice between being born and being deprived of my piece of paper, I'd tell you which one I'd pick.

[WolfRunnerWoman]

One of my favorite Dear Abby columns...just in case nobody has posted this yet. BTW, before anybody ruptures themselves jumping to conclusions, I am a forty-four-year old, married, professional woman that has NEVER been pregnant thanks to the miracle of modern conception prevention.


Ann Landers' famous "The Childless Couple"

There is nothing sadder than a childless couple. It breaks my heart to see them relaxing around swimming pools in Florida, sitting all suntanned and miserable on the decks of their boats -- trotting off to Europe like lonesome fools. It's an empty life. Nothing but money to spend, more time to enjoy and a whole lot less to worry about.

The poor childless couple are so wrapped up in themselves, you have to feel sorry for them. They don't fight over the child's discipline, don't blame each other for the child's most obnoxious characteristics, and they miss all the fun of doing without for the child's sake. They just go along, doing whatever they want, buying what they want and liking each other. It's a pretty pathetic picture.

Everyone should have children. No one should be allowed to escape the wonderful experience that accompanies each stage in the development of the young -- the happy memories of sleepless nights, coughing spells, tantrums, diaper rash, debts, "dipso" baby sitters, saturated mattresses, emergencies and never-ending crises.

How dismal is the peaceful home without the constant childish problems that make a well-rounded life and an early breakdown; the tender, thoughtful discussions when the report card reveals the progeny to be one step below a moron; the end-of-the-day reunions with all the joyful happenings recited like well-placed blows to the temples.

Children are worth it. Every moment of anxiety, every sacrifice, every complete collapse pays off as a fine, sturdy adolescent is reached. The feeling of reward the first time you took the boy hunting -- he didn't mean to shoot you, the lad was excited. Remember how he cried? How sorry he was? And how much better you felt after the blood transfusion? These are the times a man with a growing son treasures -- memories that are captured forever in the heart and the limp.

Think back to the night of romantic adventure when your budding daughter eloped with the village idiot. What childless couple ever shared in the stark realism of that drama? Aren't you a better man for having lived richly, fully, acquiring that tic in your left eye? Could a woman without children touch the strength and heroism of your wife as she tried to fling herself out of the bedroom window?

The childless couple live in a vacuum. They fill their lonely days with golf, vacation trips, dinner dates, civic affairs, tranquility, leisure and entertainment. There is a terrifying emptiness without children, but the childless couple are too comfortable to know it.

You just have to look at them to see what the years have done: He looks boyish, unlined and rested; she's slim, well-groomed and youthful. It isn't natural. If they had had kids, they'd look like the rest of us -- worn out, wrinkled and exhausted.

[HairOfTheDog]

I have never understood people who care more about animals than they do other people. I never will, but I wished you well anyway. What more do you want?

What do I want? For people making judgments about me or giving me advice to at least make a fair analysis of what is actually driving my decision, and it is much more complex than just some misguided affection for animals over people, which is not in anything I have said.