Posted on 03/10/2005 1:10:39 AM PST by familyop
Hang in there. Emotions are running high on both sides of this issue and accusations are flying all over the place. Many of us in the US are waiting for the results of the investigation. We have our suspicions but have not yet formed opinions. You will mostly hear from us after the results are published. You are quite correct that the only people who know what happened are the ones who were there and the rest is all speculation.
I wholeheartedly concur. Only, all accusations against the USA are currently being vehemently rejected by our government. When it is stated that there are differences between what we know and what the Americans say it is not to imply that soemeone is lying, but only to explain why we both are going to investigate and prove the HUGE smear campaign groundless. It's how investigations work: see what you have and check what's wrong.
None here doubts it's a normal case of friendly fire. it was officially stated and repeated. The difference is that the the leftist media overemphasized what happened and distorted facts on the ground of Sgrena's initial statements (which she already changed).
let's all THINK: who's going to benefit from a crisis between Italy and the USA? Do I need to suggest the names of at least three nations whose press is unleashing hell about this incident? Have we all already forgotten what GWB explained over and over about the importance of the role of Italy in the last three years for the success of WOT and the diplomatic efforts to overcome the offensive of the axis of weasels?
Beiside that - as someone who reads and follows US press and tv - beleive me if I say that your MSM did the job ours couldn't do. In the aftermath of the incident the communist version of facts was laughed off by most of the populace and even leftist politicians. But when they read the NYT and saw CNN they understood that it could be exploited. And now we're between a rock and a hard place.
Let me tell you that I think that something went wrong among Italians and that your boys did the right thing. When i served I was taught that "an ugly trial is always better than a wonderful funeral" so when a sentinel has doubts, he opens fire period. But then again this is speculation. Let's all wait for the results of investigations and NEVER, for any reason give credit to media reports on what people think or do.
We know what we owe to the US. Let's not help the left to distort facts once more. There's too much at stake.
The media has been fanning the flames. Our President and the Italian govt. know this.
Excellent post. Thank you.
>>> According to British publications (including conservative), Italy paid a ransom to the terrorists.Is that true?<<<
According to our government, no ransom was paid by anyone in any form. According to our government all accusations against the USA are to be deemed as leftist propaganda. Why would you sooner believe to the media than to an ally? Only because journalists will only translate from Italian what fits their forged reporting of facts??
As I said before, I am not happy with my goverment's policy on kidnappings. I don't know if they paid. They say they didn't in any form. Anyway, they sound ambiguous and I don't like that. You kill terrorists, you make them rue the day they pissed you off, that's what you do period.
The "conservative" media are in no way a more reliable source. Not always. Espacially on foreign issues. And the anti-Italian attitude of certain british press of any tendency is something you may not know about in the US but it's an old story that can be traced back to centuries ago. What I can tell you is that FOX news, for one was seldom better than CNN. Even about the US election, that I remember, especially on family/social issues. The media agenda is made of only three to-do's 1) to sell 2) to promote liberal agendas 3)do not waste time and resources analyzing things not vital to your business.
In this case, no. 1 and 3 apply. Conservatives all around the world bought the story heated up exploiting national pride. Easier, juicy, feeling-stirring.
How do they know of a ransom? Iraqi sources? Oh great. Italian sources? I can tell of at least a million bureocrats ready to leak "reliable" information against their own goverment. Always remember that what is being said by our officials these days is directed to European ears and to the left. We have to blandish them so that they will let us work on this. And that's paying off. The more facts are getting checked, the more their lies are getting exposed. Wait and don't jump from prejudice to conclusions. That's what lefties do.
DISCLAIMER: I am NOT saying that Italy did everything right here. In fact I think that we screwed up something that shouldn't have started in the first place. I am ToTALLY with the US on this.
What I am saying is wait before buying the media psycho-babble and use it to spit on those who backed you so far. That's what Bin laden wants. More important: try to separate facts from surmises. Extremely important: separate the issue of the handling of kidnappings from that of the investigation, of the bilateral relationships and of the way Italy is dealing with this story. What we have here is the media overemphasizing an ordinary case of friendly fire to undermine the coalition. We should not help this enemy effort. Of course they're exploiting it also because security issues are involved and we all must be careful when answering.
Although you don't get informed about it, the government is DEFENDING the USA against the left. The left wanted to "investigate" and expose yankee wickedness right? Fine, the investigation will be the rope that will strangle them. Do you think that Washington would EVER allow foreign judges and detectives to work with them on facts where US soldiers are under scrutiny? No they wouldn't, so if they did it's because they trust us.
ALL:
I am currently posting about this also here:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1359955/posts
where I have just posted a lenghty msg on how I see this story from other points of view than the simple ransom issue. I hope that helps.
So maybe I replied specific points elsewhere too. This double posting is a bit confusing and implies double work! (btw correct my english when necessary, I appreciate it, it helps my communication skills!)
God bless the USA
Thank you for your reply.
I think that one problem to be solved in communication between US and Italian interests might be a small cultural gap--i.e., differences in the ways we react to news events. Another might be differences in problems within each of our countries. Some problems that occur often in the USA might not be as common in Italy, and vice versa.
We Americans, on average, might be perceived by many as being a little cold, or unemotional, in some ways. At the same time, Italy communications minister Maurizio Gasparri made an interesting comment on "emotionalism and sensations" regarding reactions to current events in media in Italy.
After some US attention to popular opinions in various western European countries, some of us in the USA have learned a few things since the September Attack ("9/11"). Surveys in western Europe have shown us that the majority of people in each and every of those countries do not like President Bush or the War on Terror. We can only hope that better relations are developed by honest communication and efforts to follow. And maybe we should address European conspiracy stories (about USA-Zionist plots and like that) by analyzing the stories rather than simply ridiculing them.
A good American writer and analyzer of propaganda named Daniel Pipes addressed that in one of his articles. He wrote that we should analyze and factually reply against dishonest propaganda instead of ignoring it or laughing at it. Maybe he was correct, with the exception, in my opinion, that ridicule and generalization is effective in some cases. But the process of researching and replying to conspiracy stories is tiring.
Another international error that I've noticed over the past few years is that of nations pointing fingers at one another instead of solving their own problems. Talkers like the Bill O'Reilly of Fox News (American, but often claims to be of Irish Catholic identity) and David Irving, the Briton (who claims to be part of the "master race") instigate and continue such problems.
Socialism is apparent in almost half of the people in the USA (e.g., voters for John Kerry). The same is apparent in more than half of the people in each and every western European country, as is anti-American sentiment (numbers in polls). It's a problem to be solved and not something that can be hidden or distracted from for long.
Yes, "transparency" is important.
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