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Abortion Okayed for 13 year Old in Florida
www.foxnews.com ^ | May 3, 2005 | Fox News

Posted on 05/03/2005 9:50:07 AM PDT by IMissPresidentReagan

A judge has ruled that a 13-year-old girl at the center of an abortion fight with the state may terminate her pregnancy.

Juvenile Judge Ronald Alvarez (search) on Monday ruled that the teen, who has been in state custody for four years, would not be physically or emotionally harmed by the procedure. Last week, Alvarez blocked the girl's abortion until a psychological evaluation was completed.

"He ruled that she is competent, that she has made a decision and that she has a right to act on that decision," said Howard Simon, executive director of the Florida American Civil Liberties Union (search), which represented the girl.

The state Department of Children & Families had argued that the girl, known only in court papers as L.G., (search) was too young and immature to decide for herself to have an abortion. The agency said state law prohibited the agency from consenting to the procedure.

Children and families officials declined to comment Monday on whether they planned to appeal Alvarez's decision.

"Since this is still in litigation, I can't speak to what's going on in court," agency spokeswoman Marilyn Munoz told the South Florida Sun-Sentinel.

Attorneys for the girl said the abortion was scheduled for Monday, but it was unclear whether the girl underwent the procedure.

The girl told the judge last week as part of the psychological evaluation process that she wanted an abortion, citing her age and no way to support a baby. The girl's attorneys argue that Florida law protects a minor's right to choose an abortion.

A measure is moving through the state Legislature to require notification of parents or guardians when girls seek abortion. In 2003, the Florida Supreme Court struck down a 1999 law requiring parents to be notified if their minor daughters seek an abortion.

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: abortion; florida; flroida
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To: Jim_Curtis
It would be interesting to find out who pays for all of these abortions on demand for thirteen year old girls who probably aren't carrying a stack of money around with them.

The same people who pay to support girls like this, and their babies when they do have them, and their parents, and their "boyfriends" who (like their fathers) usually spend a good chunk of their lives in prison.

As someone who is appalled that there was even one day's delay in giving this girl an abortion, I strongly object to the proposal that those us who want state-funded abortions in situations like this should be forced to participate in the payment of the hundreds of thousands of taxpayer dollars it would take for the state to support this baby all through its life, because some people oppose abortion, while people who oppose abortion should not be forced to participate in the payment of a couple of hundred dollars for the abortion.

201 posted on 05/03/2005 2:31:04 PM PDT by GovernmentShrinker
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To: blueminnesota
Exactly. Going against the law and blocking this girl's right to decide would be judicial activism which I thought we were against. Oh, but if we don't like the rules I guess we can change them in the middle of the game.

Judicial activism is what took the law out of the legislatures hands in the first place. The law that is being enforced here is judge made law, not legislation. The rule being enforced here exists becuase of judicial activism.

Too bad the people don't have the gumption to shitcan the activist judges. Part of the rules includes the power to impeach. If the judges don't want that rule to be used, they can respect the will of the people and refrain from legislating from the bench. "Laws regarding abortion are PRESUMED TO BE UNCONSTITUTIONAL," so says the Florida Supreme Court. The people are kow-towing to judical made law that the public does not support. Evidence that the public doesn't support it? Passing of a Constitutional amendment to the privacy clause of the Florida Constitution.

202 posted on 05/03/2005 2:33:49 PM PDT by Cboldt
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To: blueminnesota
You are the real political conservative on this thread of theocrats.

Thank you. And I'd point out that not only are they theocrats, they're socialists too. Every baby born in a situation like this is another vote for socialism. This child would be utterly dependent on the state throughout its life, and wouldn't even want to imagine a form of government where s/he wasn't entitled to handouts. An anti-abortion position is not only anti-freedom for the girl/woman in question, it's even more anti-freedom for everyone in all the future generations of our nation. Liberty cannot survive an ever-growing population of government dependents.

203 posted on 05/03/2005 2:36:05 PM PDT by GovernmentShrinker
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To: Coleus

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1396083/posts
State again halts teen's abortion


204 posted on 05/03/2005 3:00:13 PM PDT by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: Cboldt
I am guessing that this is part of the admissions counseling and examination. It makes sense that the staff at the clinic would be fully equipped to qualify the patients.

Seems like a conflict of interest to have the evaluation in the clinic where the abortion will be performed.

205 posted on 05/03/2005 3:00:42 PM PDT by Jim_Curtis
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To: GovernmentShrinker
As someone who is appalled that there was even one day's delay in giving this girl an abortion, I strongly object to the proposal that those us who want state-funded abortions in situations like this should be forced to participate in the payment of the hundreds of thousands of taxpayer dollars it would take for the state to support this baby all through its life, because some people oppose abortion, while people who oppose abortion should not be forced to participate in the payment of a couple of hundred dollars for the abortion.

Some GovernmentShrinker you are. It's because we have a policy of supporting irresponsible decisions with public money that we have an out of control culture of irresponsible decisions.

Sure would cause a lot of pain if we suddenly stopped caring for all of these irresponsible individuals and the product of their poor choices but how can we be governmentshrinkers if we don't?

So why shouldn't a thirteen year old girl go out and get pregnant when she is absolved of all responsibility for her decisions, GovernmentShrinker will make things all right again with my tax dollars.

206 posted on 05/03/2005 3:34:50 PM PDT by Jim_Curtis
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To: Jim_Curtis

How will having the baby, which will then become instantly a ward of the state, make her face up to her responsibilities. You know, there are women who keep having babies despite the fact that they are instantly taken by the state because have been previously been found unfit.


207 posted on 05/03/2005 4:11:06 PM PDT by LWalk18
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To: LWalk18
How will having the baby, which will then become instantly a ward of the state, make her face up to her responsibilities. You know, there are women who keep having babies despite the fact that they are instantly taken by the state because have been previously been found unfit.

I don't care if she has the baby or not. I just don't want to be charged for carving the baby out of her womb.

If it is a matter of "spend a little to save a lot", spend the money to fix these women so they can't give birth to any more wards of the state.

Or have one of those "buyback" programs like they do for guns...ovaries for a few hits of crack, vasectomies for an armful of heroin or a bag of weed. That might sound horrible but it's not as bad as using my tax dollars to kill babies.

208 posted on 05/03/2005 4:39:16 PM PDT by Jim_Curtis
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To: Jim_Curtis
If it is a matter of "spend a little to save a lot", spend the money to fix these women so they can't give birth to any more wards of the state.

Well its too late now that she is pregnant, it has to end in her giving birth or having an abortion. She is a ward of the state of Florida, so you have been paying for her for the last four years, including when DCF allowed to run away and get pregnant in the first place.

209 posted on 05/03/2005 4:43:03 PM PDT by LWalk18
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To: LWalk18
Well its too late now that she is pregnant

It was in response to your women who keep giving birth to wards of the state.

I'm sure you would agree that it should be the policy that when public money is used to pay for an abortion that the woman be fixed at the same time so she can't become pregnant again and kill another baby at the publics expense.

210 posted on 05/03/2005 4:55:06 PM PDT by Jim_Curtis
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To: Jim_Curtis
I'm sure you would agree that it should be the policy that when public money is used to pay for an abortion that the woman be fixed at the same time so she can't become pregnant again and kill another baby at the publics expense.

Why stop at those who have an abortion? I was referring to those who give birth to children who are paid for by the state. Those women should be fixed too, since they are creating an even bigger burden to the state.

211 posted on 05/03/2005 4:58:49 PM PDT by LWalk18
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To: LWalk18
Why stop at those who have an abortion?

I didn't. I suggested we offer a bag of weed or hit of crack to these women if they will have their tubes tied.

The 1% of those who won't accept the deal, I don't have an answer for.

212 posted on 05/03/2005 5:10:21 PM PDT by Jim_Curtis
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To: GovernmentShrinker

Responsible people sometimes have lapses in judgment, but I am sure you are above that.


213 posted on 05/03/2005 5:27:47 PM PDT by ThisLittleLightofMine
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To: All; Coleus

Let's all pray for the mother and her baby, and pray that the abortion won't take place.


214 posted on 05/03/2005 5:28:10 PM PDT by Sun (Visit www.theEmpireJournal.com * Pray for Terri. Pray to end abortion.)
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To: Sun
Let's imagine Free Republic gets archived for 30 years on google. The innocent child, against all odds, slips through the cracks and gets born. Let's assume it is a girl. She gets lucky and gets taken in by a loving family. She goes to school and learns to do research on the computer when she is 17.

She stumbles across this thread in 17 years and reads how worthless her mother was, how expensive she is going to be to the state, how likely she will turn out to be trash, along with a few posters who were on her side, willing to help pay the cost to society.

How would you feel if that were you? One strike/mistake by your mother and you are worthless and should be terminated, extracted, ground up, and flushed down a drain and into Tampa Bay or wherever this is in Florida or get recycled into the city drinking water.

How will this play out on Judgement Day (hard to keep believing there will ever be one, but let's assume there is)?

We let society deteriorate to this point. It's up to us to try to bring it back to health. It all comes down to the almigty dollar.

Regarding another post, I worked with a woman with a blind eye who had been adopted and who was tinier than most 13-year-olds. Amazingly, she was a very competent legal secretary. She delivered a baby successfully who was in grade school at that time. She got lice (lots of kids do now) and I remember helping pick them out after the shampoo so she could go back to school. The daughter had the same blind eye, (maybe on the opposite side, can't remember), tended to be very chubby and unattractive. The child grew up and got pregnant. The last time I saw her she had a baby in a stroller. Wonder how that all turned out.

Who are we to determine the worth of a human being?

This ain't gonna go over too well, and I don't like to force anyone to have a baby they don't want, but I couldn't be an enabler or participant in "the procedure" in any way either. When she comes out of the clinic and if she develops complications like hemhorraging, I can take her to the local emergency room and do what I can to help her get back on her feet. From so far away, the least I can do is pray for her and all concerned for a good outcome, whatever that may be.

215 posted on 05/03/2005 6:26:50 PM PDT by Aliska
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To: Aliska
She stumbles across this thread in 17 years and reads how worthless her mother was, how expensive she is going to be to the state, how likely she will turn out to be trash, along with a few posters who were on her side, willing to help pay the cost to society.

The cold reality is that this child was conceived during an encounter between a 13 year old runaway and some slimeball. Nothing said on these boards is going to change that fact. Having the baby is not going to magically result in a happy ending- her parental rights will be terminated and the girl remaining in group home limbo, and the child would be adopted, if it is the "right" kind. Abortion offers no satisfactory conclusion either- the baby dies, the mother will be forgotten in foster care by her "supporters". Either way, the slimeball who got her pregnant will get away.

This girl's life was a tragedy long before she got pregnant, and it seems certain that it will continue to be no matter what happens. And she is just one of many "throwaway" children. No one has yet come up with an answer on what to do with these children.

216 posted on 05/03/2005 6:38:44 PM PDT by LWalk18
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To: LWalk18; Aliska

Bottom line: God is pro-life. Choose life.


217 posted on 05/03/2005 6:43:49 PM PDT by Sun (Visit www.theEmpireJournal.com * Pray for Terri. Pray to end abortion.)
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To: Jim_Curtis
If it is a matter of "spend a little to save a lot", spend the money to fix these women so they can't give birth to any more wards of the state.

I'm all for that, but I still don't want each and every one of these women/girls dropping an unwanted baby (usually also permanently screwed up from birth, due to a combination of bad genes and bad in utero environment) into the world, for us to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on, before we spend a couple hundred to "fix" them.

218 posted on 05/03/2005 7:29:59 PM PDT by GovernmentShrinker
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To: ThisLittleLightofMine

Responsible people also quickly take steps to reverse any ill effects of their occasional lapses in judgement (or of contraceptive failure). If it wasn't responsible to plan on having a child at a given time, it's not responsible to continue an accidental pregnancy more than a couple of days beyond when it's discovered. Either way, a person who might have had a life doesn't -- it hardly matters if you prevent conception or undo it shortly after the fact. What really pisses me off is anti-abortion activists who put up as many obstacles as they can to women and girls seeking abortions, and then express horror at late abortions. Guess why they're done late? Because the delays you caused made them late.


219 posted on 05/03/2005 7:38:09 PM PDT by GovernmentShrinker
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To: GovernmentShrinker
13 year olds are not "responsible". They do not understand the ramifications of any of their "choices". That being said regardless of when a person chooses to abort a child it is still a life. I suppose it makes it more palatable for the pro-death club to advertise the morning after pill as the solution but the end result is the same whether you take the morning after pill or your wait and have a partial birth abortion. These are both murders. I suppose you would also be a proponent to infanticide, again I see no difference in any of the procedures. If one has a lapse in judgment and makes a terrible mistake they should do the responsible thing, have the child and give it for adoption if they are unable to care for that child. Do you have children? Have you seen a "real" babies in the womb? Have you seen a baby at 12 weeks? If you are ever in Portland Oregon I would suggest you go visit an exhibit at the OMSI, it shows "real babies" from 3 weeks until 40, all of these babies died in the womb and were donated to this musuem. No one could ever view this exhibit and ever feel that abortion is simply a "choice".
220 posted on 05/04/2005 7:09:08 AM PDT by ThisLittleLightofMine
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