Posted on 06/03/2005 5:26:31 PM PDT by 4.1O dana super trac pak
Edited on 06/03/2005 5:32:39 PM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]
DES MOINES, IA - Rep. Steve King, R- Iowa, called Friday for deploying the military to seal the borders against illegal immigration, coupled with new financial penalties for companies that hire illegals.
"The destination of America is going to be shaped alot by immigration policy," said King, who said he will introduce legislation "in the next several weeks."
Click link for more..
"It isn't the National Guard's job to fight wars anywhere else."
Oh, you want to go back to the era where the cowards hid out in the Guard, eh? Fat lot of good they'd do in guarding the border, then.
"Defense of the borders of the US is one of the Guard's stated, mandated missions. The Guard has been misused for the last 25 years as the backup for the active duty."
There was a specific reason for doing that. The Joint Chiefs set it up that way so that, the next time some damn fool politician wanted to send a bunch of troops somewhere in the name of "doing something," he'd have to call up the Guard, and thus be forced to explain exactly why Joe the barber and Bob the auto mechanic were being sent to some place nobody had ever heard of.
The brigade sized element is in keeping with the active duty Army realigning into brigade-sized units of action / units of employment. Under that system, the brigade, not the division, will be the smallest tactical unit capable of supporting itself in combat. The Guard calls them Seperate Infantry (or armor) Brigades. The 48th Enhanced Separate Infantry Brigade (Mech) from Georgia is a prime example.
Then they'll just go around. Cover the whole damn border, or you're just making the problem for someone else.
Of course they'll go around. I wouldn't expect the Guard to cover any but the highest-speed avenues of approach and channelize the illegals into the most undesirable terrain. You won't catch 100%, but combined with even half-assed interior enforcement, you'd have a much more secure border than we do now.
Until they throw tracks and break torsion bars near where I live. The terrain on much of the border is lousy if you're a track-toad.
That's the price of doing business with tracks if you drive them too hard. Another idea would be to go to motorized (ie, mounted in Humvee) units.
I never said this would be the be-all, end-all solution. I just said it'd be far better than what we have now.
"The brigade sized element is in keeping with the active duty Army realigning into brigade-sized units of action / units of employment."
Nice bit of obfuscation, pal. You told me that the National Guard musters enough troops to put a full brigade on the border year-round, doing nothing resembling their military mission.
I'm calling "Bravo Sierra."
"That's the price of doing business with tracks if you drive them too hard. Another idea would be to go to motorized (ie, mounted in Humvee) units."
OK, so you break axles instead of throw tracks.
The terrain here is walkable. It is not driveable.
You mean like when President Bush was in the Guard?
There was a specific reason for doing that. The Joint Chiefs set it up that way so that, the next time some damn fool politician wanted to send a bunch of troops somewhere in the name of "doing something," he'd have to call up the Guard, and thus be forced to explain exactly why Joe the barber and Bob the auto mechanic were being sent to some place nobody had ever heard of.
Nice try, but not even close. The Joint Chiefs didn't change anything except increasing the funding to the Guard. The Federal government now pays close to 95% of the costs of training and equipping the National Guard. The reason for the increased funding was to create and maintain a pool of reasonably well-trained and well-equipped troops that could be called up in short order (90 days) to fill out the active duty. That's why 52% of the combat power of the US Army is in the National Guard - it's way cheaper than having *another* ten divisions on active duty. It's simple cost-benefit analysis.
That's exactly what I said, in response to your question of whether or not the Guard had any full-size divisions. They do, but they're really designed to work in brigade sized elements.
Oh, and you're right - patrolling, gathering, interpreting, and acting on intelligence, conducting defense in depth, movement to contact, exercising your medical and maintenance units, etc... those aren't military missions at all.
"You mean like when President Bush was in the Guard?"
Let's not forget Vice President Dan Quayle and a whole boatload of Democrats, too.
I went to 'Nam. I wasn't a fortunate son. I guess you want to restore the Guard to its former position of prominence as a hangout for fortunate sons of the rich and prominent--hell, the local NG unit roster was a generation back of the local country club roster.
"Nice try, but not even close. The Joint Chiefs didn't change anything except increasing the funding to the Guard."
They also realigned the Army so that most of the combat service support is in the Guard and Reserve.
Baloney. The Congressman has called for steeper penalties for employers who hire illegals. It's in the first paragraph in the article.
So you've conceded my original argument--that this guy hasn't supported the increased manpower his pet mission will require.
Why would I concede anything when your assertion is silly?
I know Steve King, and he'll support whatever funding is needed to protect our national sovereignty.
"Why would I concede anything when your assertion is silly?"
By continuously refusing to address it.
Bottom line: our military is stretched as tight as it will go thanks to a decade of the Republican-dominated Congress refusing to pony up for the additional manpower we need. And now we have grandstanders demanding that the troops get MORE missions to perform, just as the military is going through yet another round of troop reductions.
"I know Steve King, and he'll support whatever funding is needed to protect our national sovereignty."
He hasn't supported it before. What makes you so certain he will support it now?
Sorry, I judge politicians by what they have actually done, not by what they've flapped their jaws about. It's a legacy of my time in 'Nam.
Your assertions about the Congressman remain specious, nonetheless.
"Your assertions about the Congressman remain specious, nonetheless."
My assertion is that he has not supported such manpower increases in the past, nor has he supported any such manpower increases in connection with his present proposal. That's not "specious." It's merely a statement of fact.
Why don't you show me the legislation he's sponsored to make the US military much bigger in order to meet all of its missions?
I have better things to do today than to talk to you, since you have no intention of listening.
"I have better things to do today than to talk to you, since you have no intention of listening."
In other words, he's done nothing to increase the manpower of the US military, so you're going to run away.
That's all right by me. Just don't expect anyone else to take him, or you, seriously.
Connecticut, is beoing invaded also? Wow, is there a single state left that has not been invaded?
You going to guard 2,000 miles of US-Mexican border for free?<<<
Plenty would be willing (just ask The Minutemen), but they should not have to. TAX DOLLARS, for once, can be used for a constitutional reason: Protecting this Country.
If a temperary project such as the minutemen can bring that many unpaid Patriots, I'm sure someting could be worked out for our borders full-time.
I personally know 10 people who will patrol the Border with the Minutemen in Texas this Year. I'm sure that number will increase as word gets around. These same folks have the means and the will, to join a full-time Militia.
I myself will give one week vacation to the Patrol, others, who have no need for full time employement, can and will do "their time" watching the Border as well.
"Plenty would be willing (just ask The Minutemen), but they should not have to."
Well, you're apparently not willing to spend the money.
"TAX DOLLARS, for once, can be used for a constitutional reason: Protecting this Country."
Uh-huh. Representative King has yet to propose doing that.
"If a temperary project such as the minutemen can bring that many unpaid Patriots, I'm sure someting could be worked out for our borders full-time. "
Sure. We have that many patriots who don't need to work for a living. Yeah, right...
"I personally know 10 people who will patrol the Border with the Minutemen in Texas this Year. I'm sure that number will increase as word gets around. These same folks have the means and the will, to join a full-time Militia."
Sure they will.
"I myself will give one week vacation to the Patrol,"
Okay, so what about the other 51 weeks of the year?
"others, who have no need for full time employement, can and will do "their time" watching the Border as well."
Sp you're saying that the same people who, by and large, shouldn't be trusted with a car because of crappy reflexes and eyesight, are going to stand post with a rifle.
That ought to work real good!
What Bush and the admin. have to do is have a frank talk with the US voter about what's going on with illegal immigration/migration. The alternatives facing the US, economic and social reality in the rest of the hemisphere and probable consequences. What would happen if we did nothing. We tried exporting capitalism, now we're at it again. He should have done this right after he won the second term.
True, this isn't easy. You don't want to insult other countries, inflame ingrained anti-American prejudices, etc., and Hispanics have been known to be thin-skinned (macho), but he should have considered Americans. It's our country, not everyone else's. This blind eye nonsense is a cheat and a lie. Well, from that speech today at the OAS, it looks as if he's about to reveal the little man behind the curtain, and God help us.
Yes, indeedy.
"When the USA won her Independence and when we fought our own civil war, there were good people willing to work and fight hard for the benefit of this country. People willing to sacrifice for a greater cause than themselves and their own comfort."
I'm not talking about their comfort. I'm talking about putting food on the table for their families.
Or are they supposed to put their families on welfare so they can don cammies and tote a rifle all day?
Or will they make their money by "confiscating contraband from illegal aliens" for resale?
"could it be that they are slowley getting the message?
"
They had best get the message or they will fail to get the votes.
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