How Intelligent Design Hurts Conservatives (By making us look like crackpots)

The New Republic ^ | 8/16/05 | Ross Douthat

[MitchellC]

Why would a perfect creation create sin?

Sin isn't a "thing," so much as it is the natural opposite of a thing, God's will.

If creation were perfect, that would mean it was the way God wanted it to be.

God created a creation that could share his will only by acting freely.

As for why God would create a world that would fall, what is the point of the question? Is it impossible that a perfect God would do such a thing?

[TheClintons-STILLAnti-American]

"But you don't ask others, you tell them.Because you possess the absolute truth."

Thank you for acknowledging that.

The difference is, the truth I possess doesn't come from my own superior wisdom.

Forgive me if the truth offends you. That's in the Bible, too.

[mordo]

A deeply held belief has the power of truth

NO, that is where you are wrong. Believe it as you will though.

Only truth has the power of truth.

[GSHastings]

I am saying your truths are your beliefs.

There is no truth here I do believe, only beliefs. A deeply held belief has the power of truth but not all hold your particular deeply held belief.

Like wow. You're giving me flashbacks man. (that's meant as humor)

Listen to me Caj, there isn't anything in what your are trying to say that I don't get. I've been through EST, Yoga, Buddism, Transendental Meditation, Astral Projection. I've done pot, mescaline, LSD. I read Carlos Castinada obsessively. I read Seth Speaks obsessivly. I've been there, done that (all of it). Becoming a Christian was the last thing I could possibly imagine.

It AIN'T SO. Your beliefs do NOT determine your truth! Your beliefs are your beliefs. Nothing more, and they alter truth not one iota.

There is nothing NEW about your New Age beliefs. It's the OLDEST lie in the history of man, and you can read about it in the book of Genesis.

There is only ONE truth. Drop an object, and it will fall to the ground. Every single time. Gravity exists. It is Truth. We don't live in multiple realities.

[b9]

A deeply held belief has the power of truth

In the same way a little Christmas tree light has the whole power of the Hoover Dam behind it.

[cajungirl]

Perhaps a better word was religion. Doesn't belong in public schools.

[b9]

I so totally agree. 100%

[DaveTesla]

"And the only evidence for ID is faith. And faith has no place in schools or science."

As an engineer and a scientist I beg to differ with you.
As a layman (laywoman) because you hold a theory (evolution) as your fact you say that our theory has no place in the schools or science.

You would be probably telling that to the Wright brothers 100 years ago.

If I can make room for your THEORY why can't you make room for mine?

Yeah, present both sides. What are you afraid of?

As to the founding Fathers being of old, I guess we will
have to regress back to learn what they knew.
Didn't the come here in search of freedom of religious
and social beliefs?

To quote Winston Churchill,
The only thing you can learn in life is the history you
didn't already know.

What interests the champions of all the major progressives
- the radical naturalists, the Marxist / Communist, the multiculturalists,
and the sexual hedonists-is the destruction of the traditional
Judaeo-Christian family and culture. This is the tie that
binds. Christians and their values are all that stand in
the way of their creating their own heavens on earth. "In
a world without God," said Sartre (paraphrasing
Dostoevsky), "anything is permitted." That "anything"
includes deceit, dishonesty and murder.


By the way isn't that a pogrom of the left?
That times are different and and the principals that our nation was founded on and the constitution no longer applies.

I am tolerant of you.

Why would you wish to silence me.

[cajungirl]

Perhaps I was too subtle.

I was referring to the faith as described by some posters,,that the only way to God is throught Christ, etc, the duty to spread that, the idea that there is one true way and it is theirs. That is what I was objecting to.

That doesn't belong in the public schools. And that is the agenda of the ID people whether they admit it or not.

I don't think it is odd to object to that. I see that as Faith, Muslim stye myself.

[GSHastings]

In the same way a little Christmas tree light has the whole power of the Hoover Dam behind it.

If everyone lit, just one little candle....

we'd have a lot more smog :-)

[HiTech RedNeck]

I read the Book and there is nothing in it about evolving from a formerly believed primordial cold, recently discovered hot soup.

Visit a Campbellite church /pun

[cajungirl]

You are talking of religion not a mere difference in opinion about scientific theory.

I don't wish to silence you. I don't want your teachings in the public schools. And that is the agenda. And it is a dangerous one.

You can preach and talk and worship in your tax exempt religion places to your heart's content.

[b9]

the principals that our nation was founded on

Do you mean principles?

[DaveTesla]

"Perhaps a better word was religion. Doesn't belong in public schools."

But the atheist/marxist religion does?

All we have done is replace one with the other.

Seen what is going on in the public schools lately?
Or even worse in the universities? Our nation is loosing it.
You don't even get a decent education anymore.
Especially in the engineering and sciences.
Mostly you get leftist indoctrination.
And your afraid of religion?
Wait till you see what they (the left) are replacing it with.

If my poor grandmother were alive today she would die of a
stroke at the sight of it.

This is progress?

Looks more like the fall of Rome to me.

[mordo]

At pubemd there are 19,222 references to consciousness.

I don't think many reference the left little toe as the seat of consciousness.

NO FOR SURE.., that conclusion can be reached without reading anything anywhere at at all. Is this 'more best of the best' contributions of the evo ping list.

Aww ...From many - one, You guys really kill me!! HA HA HA HA HA HA ROFLAMO...!!! oh, oh, its hard to breathe!! please stop!!!

[DaveTesla]

Yes.

It's late.

[b9]

Where did she say anything about an athiest/marxist religion?

[DaveTesla]

She didn't.

I am telling her that is what they are teaching.

Sexual perversion too.

That should build a strong nation right?

Or perhaps a nation of dysfunctional worthless serfs.

[Blind Eye Jones]

Eveolution = Christ/evolution

Perhaps, just perhaps, the monolith in "2001 a Oddyessy" ended up in Mecca and Arabs are the descendants of violent chimps and apes. If the Islamofastists do destroy western culture and create a world Caliphate, we'll have a repeat of "Planet of the Apes." My point is that if we have evolved from the apes to this stage, the final stage may be a return to Ape rule.

To offset this eventual possibility Christianity and evolution should reveal themselves merging in ID: Eveolution. They are not mutually exclusive.

As well, the Left is known for calling GW Bush a chimp and not a Christian, which reveals their sympathies with the terrorists/monkeys. They are projecting their latent and nascent fantasies forward, toward a future ruling Muslim Ape. The left still has to evolve with Christianity.

[cajungirl]

atheism and Marxism have nothing to do with the teaching of sciences in the universities.

If your view of the culture "falling apart" were true, the answer is not to infuse religion into the schools and government.

There is ample reason to be afraid of religion in government and schools.

That is why there are private religious schools, churches, families, synagogues, etc.

And I do not think there is leftist indoctrination of engineering and science students.

Cultural changes happen. We don't need a Taliban or its equivalent here. I do believe the rise of Islamic fundamentalism was fueled by fear of western decadence. The rise of religious fundamentalism in this country I do think is fueled by the same fears of decadence.