Posted on 08/23/2005 1:48:53 PM PDT by jb6
It seems that most Russians are not ready to discard the myth that Joseph Stalin "won the war" over Nazi Germany. According to 58% of respondents, Stalin made a major contribution to the Soviet Union's victory. This opinion was mostly shared by people over 55 (68%), village dwellers (65%), and almost unanimously by KPRF followers (85%), while the opposite opinion is expressed by only 18% of respondents. Residents of big cities and people with a higher education were more likely to disparage Stalin's role than others.
Many people (40%) estimate Stalin’s activity in World War II positively, while 31% think it was positive and negative in equal degree, and only 11% estimate it as absolutely negative. KPRF followers (64%), people over 55 (50%), and respondents with an unfinished secondary education (46%) were more likely to estimate Stalin’s activity during the war as absolutely positively, while complicated estimations were mostly given by people who trust President Putin and respondents with comparatively large incomes (37% each). Absolutely negative evaluations were mostly expressed by respondents with a higher education (18%).
Respondents were asked open-ended questions about Stalin’s achievements and failures during World War II. 59% agreed to answer the question about his achievements. Respondents were most likely to consider Stalin to be a talented organizer, and note his ability to establish order and discipline under conditions of war ("total discipline", "order in the country", "he was high-handed with the country") - 20%. Stalin’s personal qualities were mentioned as well: heartless, purposeful, strong-willed and responsible ("justified cruelty"; "his strong nature"; "cruelty – because there was no choice") - 12%. Five percent of respondents are convinced that Stalin developed the strategy of military operations, issued orders, and organized the work of the home front. Many people say it would have been impossible to beat Nazi Germany without Stalin ("our victory would have been impossible without him"; "if there had been no Stalin, Germany would have won") - 8%.
Another groups of answers include the characteristics of the Soviet people – their unity, steadfastness and patriotism (12%). Stalin here is described as a leader who managed to mobilize these qualities ("he inspired people for victory") or as a symbol of unity ("solders began an attack by shouting his name, he was the symbol"). Three percent of respondents think talented military leaders and ordinary Russians played the main role in defeating the Nazis, not Stalin.
53% of respondents talked about Stalin's negative influence during the war. They were most likely to speak about mass repression and arrests, and genocide against their own citizens ("terror against our own people"; "concentration camps"; "he ordered the killing of those who were not guilty"; "genocide against our own people") - 24%. Some respondents (11%) spoke about his cruelty and despotism ("heartless"; "Stalin didn’t care about the people"; "a persecution mania"). 20% of respondents blame Stalin for incompetence and irresponsibility, mistakes in strategy and criminal actions before and during the war ("killing of our military elite"; "he caused the collapse of our army shortly before the war"; "he was incompetent in military matters"; "he didn’t sign the Geneva Convention"; "everything that related to prisoners").
The Public Opinion Foundation. Russia-wide poll of urban and rural population conducted in 100 residencies in 44 regions, territories, and republics, in all economic and geographical areas of Russia. Interviews are conducted at the homes of interviewees. Household interviews with a sample size of 1500 respondents. The margin of error does not exceed 3.6%. April 23, 2005.
Stalin was worse than Hitler.
Surprisingly few American generals were cashiered during WW2. Lloyd Fredendahl was replaced as II Corps commander by Patton, but that's about it. Terry Allen was relieved as commander of the 1st Infantry Division, but he was given another division to train & command so that was kind of a sideways move.
The German timetable for the invasion of Russia was upset by the need to bail-out the failed Italian invasion of Albania. The forces earmarked to assault Russia were diverted toward Greece. What should have been a spring-time invasion didn't happen until summer.
Yes. The Germans were sidetracked on a revenge strike into the Balkans. This delayed the launch of Barbarossa until the summer solstice, robbing the OKW of six weeks of good weather.
Stalin was for nobody but himself. The Soviet Union aligned with Germany in the Nazi-Soviet pact in order to bring about war within the capitalist west. They thought that it would sap the strength of both sides and leave the Soviets to pick up the pieces. No doubt he was shocked when the Germans overran France in 6 weeks - leaving him all alone with Hitler on the continent.
Read "Mein Kampf". Hitler's goal was to create "Lebensraum" in EASTERN Europe -- all the way to the Ural Mountains. He was basically ready to de-populate the area of slavic peoples, whom he considered to be inferior, and replace them with Germans. Hitler had no intention of doing this sort of thing in the West, though he tinkered with the French frontier a bit.
Kommunistichska Partiya Russkaye Federatsi
You mean if Stalin hadn't butchered all the brains in the military, destroyed the preset partisan warfare cadres set in all frontier villages, and ignored all the warnings that the Germans were coming?
It had a lot to do with the fact the war was fought on Soviet soil and the Nazis were exterminating the population in the occupied areas.
They waited because Mussilini started a war with Greece he was loosing and Hitler had to deal with British allied Greece and had to go through Yugoslavia to get to it. That cost time.
Hitler's generals failed to take Moscow & Leningrad in 1941 -- the first year of the war in the East. The Germans moved into the Caucasus as soon as the weather permitted in 1942. Stalingrad happened that winter (1942).
German tactical & operational superiority was based upon maneuver. If they'd hunkered down into a relatively passive defense, as you suggested, the much larger Soviet Army would have picked them apart (as they ultimately did after Operation Bagratian). Hitler & the German General Staff were "Pot Committed".
The Italian invasion of Albania was a walk over. It was their invasion of Greece that turned into a total route.
Hitler would have defeated the USSR if he had only insisted that Japan make attacks against the eastern USSR prior to attacking Pearl Harbor. Japan needed Hitler's assurance that he would declare war on the US.
Hitler gave that assurance and asked for absolutely nothing in return. That was stupid for Japan as well because they needed to ensure that Germany took care of Russia before attacking the US.
If Japan had made only moderately large attacks on the USSR, that would have prevented Stalin from moving his best Siberian divisions from eastern USSR in December, 1941, thus saving Moscow.
It is all true, that the Germans were sidetracked, delayed, etc. But whatever the reason for it, they invaded Russia in the Fall without equipment for the winter, which has come to Russia every single year since the dawn of time.
They planned on a quick victory, but did not even have the basic equipment to forestall a disaster if things bogged down.
That is why I call the German planners fools. A predictable, certain phenomenon was coming, quite soon, and the Germans were unprepared for it.
Napoleon's army was better prepared for the Russian Winter than Hitler's, the French had to WALK to Moscow and they actually GOT there, and that still didn't save them. The Germans drove in, didn't get to Moscow.
The French starved in a winter retreat, but large numbers of Germans FROZE to death. What happened to Napoleon's army was probably not avoidable (other than by not invading at all). What happened to the Nazis was completely avoidable, and it wasn't avoided because the German planners were fools.
"It had a lot to do with the fact the war was fought on Soviet soil and the Nazis were exterminating the population in the occupied areas."
Exactly- being on the receiving end of a war of extermination tends to concentrate the fighting spirit. Not saying the Russians didn't fight bravely, but they didn't have a whole lot of choice. They were sending supplies to Hitler right up to the moment they had to start fighting for their lives.
The British soldiers didn't fight with the same desperation, but Britain, unlike Russia, showed national courage by standing up to Hitler even after France was overrun.
As they do every year. Luckily for the Russians, the German planners were fools and invaded Russia unprepared for winter."
And don't forget Churchill's role. He saw the German invasion of Russian coming and delayed it by 45 days. How? By fomenting the uprising in Yugoslavia. Hitler brutally repressed that uprising in spring 1941 with some of the troops intended for Operation Barbarossa. So the invasion happened in late June rather than early May. Those 45 days might well have saved Moscow from being occupied. The German final offensive in Moscow happened in mid-November; had it been late September, Moscow might have captured and the outcome of the war in the East might have been different.
It was Hitler's arrogance that doomed his armies in Russia. His Generals knew better.
I also wonder what would have happened had the Afrika Korps not been so successful. Would North Africa have remained an "Economy of Force" theater that could have been maintained a less cost. People forget that the Germans lost almost as many men in Bizerta/Tunis as they did when Stalingrad capitulated. If those high-quality Wehrmacht units had been available to the Russian front in 1942...
Well, if the OKW wanted to issue winter oils or antifreeze or quilted uniforms, they would need Hitler's approval (not likely, given that Hitler was unable/unwilling to concede they would not succeed before winter), or they would need to sidestep Hitler (both unwise and difficult).
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