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Congress Bars Schools From Requiring ADHD Drug Treatment (just the House, not the do nothing Senate)
Fox news ^ | Nov. 17, 2005 | Todd Zwillich

Posted on 11/20/2005 6:36:23 PM PST by ChildOfThe60s

The U.S. House overwhelmingly passed a bill Wednesday barring schools from requiring hyperactive children to use drug treatments as a condition for attending classes.

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 109th; adhd; attentiondeficit; childabuse; drugs; pspl; ritalin; schools
Lance Clawson, MD, an assistant clinical professor of psychiatry at Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences in Washington, says schools don’t have the power to force medications on parents.

Total baloney. Besides telling parents they will kick the kid out of school, they also threaten to notify Family Services. Here in Florida, once they do that, your life is ruined. Regardless of how baseless a charge is, Family Services NEVER removes you from their database.

1 posted on 11/20/2005 6:36:25 PM PST by ChildOfThe60s
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To: ChildOfThe60s

Where in the Constitution does it say Congress has the power to micro-manage school affairs? Maybe there is a problem here that needs to be addressed, but as usual the Republicans are doig virtually as poor a job as the other wing of the socialist/humanist party when it comes to governing *lawfully*.


2 posted on 11/20/2005 6:55:16 PM PST by Liberty1970
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To: ChildOfThe60s

ADD is so horribly overused anyway.


3 posted on 11/20/2005 6:55:32 PM PST by Angry Republican (Sometimes you gotta look in the mirror and say: "When in rome.")
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To: kenth; CatoRenasci; Marie; PureSolace; Congressman Billybob; P.O.E.; cupcakes; Amelia; Dianna; ...

4 posted on 11/20/2005 7:00:14 PM PST by Born Conservative ("Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." -Donald Rumsfeld)
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To: ChildOfThe60s
Lance Clawson, MD, an assistant clinical professor of psychiatry at Uniformed Services University of the Health Sciences in Washington, says schools don’t have the power to force medications on parents.

Total baloney. Besides telling parents they will kick the kid out of school, they also threaten to notify Family Services.

Dr. Clawson is correct, at least here in Georgia. Teachers and administrators are not medical people, and are not qualified to diagnose or treat disorders such as ADD/ADHD.

5 posted on 11/20/2005 7:06:05 PM PST by Amelia
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To: ChildOfThe60s

It's my opinion that this bill is appropriate; the schools should NOT be forcing children to go on meds. I see it all of the time; the schools think that they are the primary caretakers of the children, and they butt in on their healthcare issues, when they have no right to do so.

I agree that there are many children that are labeled as ADHD, but don't necessarily have it. Many of these kids are conduct problems, or kids that are just being "kids". However, I DON'T dismiss that there are kids and adults with ADHD; I've seen it many times, both in the patients I took care of, and in several co-workers. Meds are appropriate in some cases, and can allow the person to focus better and to slow down to a normal pace. Some people don't like the effects of the meds, and would rather be hyper; if so, that's their decision, and it should be respected. But so many people dismiss the diagnosis of ADHD as bogus; it isn't.

Also, it sounds as though Florida's Family Service system is out of control.


6 posted on 11/20/2005 7:19:44 PM PST by Born Conservative ("Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion." -Donald Rumsfeld)
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To: Amelia

It doesn't seem to stop many from doing just that.


7 posted on 11/20/2005 7:47:39 PM PST by thoughtomator (Democrats think 1984 is an instruction manual)
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To: ChildOfThe60s

This is a very pleasant surprise. I had long since thought the Congress to be too beholden to pharmas to ever consider such a measure.


8 posted on 11/20/2005 7:48:30 PM PST by thoughtomator (Democrats think 1984 is an instruction manual)
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To: thoughtomator
It doesn't seem to stop many from doing just that.

Do you have personal knowledge of any doing that?

9 posted on 11/20/2005 7:53:25 PM PST by Amelia
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To: Amelia

Some references for your consideration:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1153623/posts
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1440483/posts
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1287349/posts


There's more, but that should be enough to demonstrate that the problem is real.


10 posted on 11/20/2005 8:00:51 PM PST by thoughtomator (Democrats think 1984 is an instruction manual)
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To: Liberty1970

I agree. I don't see this as the realm of the US Congress. Seems like a waste of the US Congress' time. Let state legislatures decide this sort of thing. I agree with the notion that school administrators should not force children to take meds. I just don't want the feds to be enforcing this.


11 posted on 11/20/2005 8:04:21 PM PST by petitfour
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To: Amelia
Teachers and administrators are not medical people, and are not qualified to diagnose or treat disorders such as ADD/ADHD.

Yes, that is true. But that is not what he said, which is what I am disputing.

The school administrators can indirectly force it. Teacher says Joey is a problem, looks to her as if he may be ADD. Principle tells parents that in order for Joey to stay in school he has be examined by the school's recommended Dr. Said Dr. is known to rubber stamp school's recommendation most of the time. Dr. says Joey likely ADD, prescribes meds. School says Joey takes these meds or they will remove him from school and/or report his parents to Family Services for not following Dr's instructions. Family Services must investigate every report. It is very intrusive and FS is likely to side with school unless Joey's parents spend mucho dinero on legal support. Even then, FS has the legal authority to remove Joey from his parent's home. It is not necessarily likely they will do so, but they are known to be very arbitrary when challenged. Joey's parent's lives become living hell.

Trust me. It happens.

Clawson's assertion that schools don't have power is disingenuous. Or else he is ignorant.

This should be dealt with at the county level, and it is not. Which is why desperate parents are going up the line to congress. And more local control of schools is ceded to the feds.

12 posted on 11/20/2005 8:05:14 PM PST by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s......you weren't really there.)
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To: thoughtomator

It is the NEA they are beholden to. And it teachers and administrators that are very much in favor of behavior modification via drugs.


13 posted on 11/20/2005 8:08:03 PM PST by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s......you weren't really there.)
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To: ChildOfThe60s
The school administrators can indirectly force it. Teacher says Joey is a problem, looks to her as if he may be ADD.

I am a teacher. We've been told that we can't even suggest that Joey might be ADD, because that's making or suggesting a diagnosis we are not qualified to make.

My experience has been that parents are more likely to want their children labeled ADD/ADHD than teachers are, because parents use the label as an excuse for their childrens' poor behavior...it's not that Joey has never been properly trained, it's that he's ADHD, you know?

That being as it may, I wonder why the House is working on this law now? thoughtomator's 2nd link says a similar federal law went into effect July 1 of this year. Wonder why they need to pass it again, or if that is proof that they just pass all these bills without reading them?

14 posted on 11/20/2005 8:13:32 PM PST by Amelia
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To: ChildOfThe60s; Amelia

Ultimately this boils down to Ritalin inducing a chemical condition of slavery in the children, which is why it is properly a federal issue. Fundamental human rights are at stake - the very right to be who you are.


15 posted on 11/20/2005 8:15:02 PM PST by thoughtomator (Democrats think 1984 is an instruction manual)
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To: ChildOfThe60s
The school administrators can indirectly force it. Teacher says Joey is a problem, looks to her as if he may be ADD. Principle tells parents that in order for Joey to stay in school he has be examined by the school's recommended Dr. Said Dr. is known to rubber stamp school's recommendation most of the time.

My middle daughter was having difficulty at one point in first grade. The school wanted her to see one of their recommended doctors.

They called us into a meeting to discuss this. I said I declined to allow this. They said OK, please sign this statement that you decline to allow her to be seen by their doc. My antenna went up at this -- it should be the case that my signing would only be necessary if I agree to it. I went home and looked at their "disclosure" handout. Buried about 23 pages in was some legalese that said that if I refused the school could appeal to a judge, who could authorize the examination. In which case it would happen during school hours and without our knowledge. But they needed my signed refusal to present to the judge

So the next day I dropped off paperwork saying she was now pulled out and we were homeschooling her (we were already homeschooling the oldest for different reasons)

16 posted on 11/20/2005 8:15:18 PM PST by SauronOfMordor (I do what the voices in lazamataz's head tell me to)
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To: Amelia
We've been told that we can't even suggest that Joey might be ADD

I'm glad to hear that. But that is certainly not the case in Polk County, FL. Or anywhere else in this state that I am aware of.

You are correct that many parents are only too willing to go for the ADD diagnosis. I know several myself. They simply would not do what is necessary as a parent to deal with the kid, when they could abdicate responsibility for the child this way.

17 posted on 11/20/2005 8:22:08 PM PST by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s......you weren't really there.)
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To: Liberty1970

I think the republicans are attempting to send a message to the National teachers unions who have been at the forfront of pushing drugs on to these kids. All in the name of classroom management. Technically this should be a state or local issue...but because we already have a federalized dept of education, they are attempting a national policy.


18 posted on 11/20/2005 8:24:46 PM PST by Katya (Homo Nosce Te Ipsum)
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To: SauronOfMordor
We originally began homeschooling my daughter (now an adult college grad) because the school demanded that all kids in 1st grade take a nap each day. Well, she had stopped naps several years earlier and we knew there was no way she would submit to the naps. And it wasn't long that we realized the level of regimentation at the school which she would never follow. Around here that was sufficient to start the whole ADD nightmare.

So we bit the financial bullet and my wife did not work for 11 years. And it really hurt moneywise. Smartest decision we ever made.

19 posted on 11/20/2005 8:29:09 PM PST by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s......you weren't really there.)
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To: petitfour
"I agree with the notion that school administrators should not force children to take meds. I just don't want the feds to be enforcing this."

Well, what I see the feds doing is restraining the SCHOOLs from forcing a drugging of children on the parents. These parents can still choose to let their kids take those drugs if they think it is needed.

20 posted on 11/20/2005 8:35:50 PM PST by det dweller too
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To: Amelia
I didn't want my child labeled as ADD or ADHD, but his teacher continued complaining of restlesness in my 4th grader. We relented and took my son to an appropriate doctor who discovered he is ADHD - little boys' disease.

We decided to experiment on the school system. We reported the diagnosis and informed them that he would be taking his medication at home before school each day. Of course we did not medicate him. Soon the notes from school were glowing of improved attention and performance. There was no change in his exam scores but the grades for behavior escalated!

Apparently, a diagnosis of ADD or ADHD in students works wonders for the behavior of grade school teachers. The added benefit of this silly experiment is that my son now has extra time to complete his tests. I understand that when he sits for his SAT's he will also receive extra time to complete that important timed test as well.

I encourage all Freepers to have their young children tested for ADD or ADHD to take advantage of the untold benefits of placating looney left wingery.

21 posted on 11/20/2005 8:37:33 PM PST by Nomorjer Kinov
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Comment #22 Removed by Moderator

To: ChildOfThe60s

says schools don’t have the power to force medications on parents. >>

No, they just call family services and have the parents arrested for abuse and neglect.


23 posted on 11/20/2005 9:51:39 PM PST by Coleus (Roe v. Wade and Endangered Species Act both passed in 1973, Murder Babies/save trees, birds, algae)
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To: ChildOfThe60s
One out of every eight American boys is taking Ritalin. The United States consumes over 90 percent of all the Ritalin used worldwide.

This is a potentially dangerous drug, and if you're a parent of a child who is taking it, you need to spend time studying the long-term health consequences.
24 posted on 11/21/2005 3:21:35 AM PST by RavenATB (Patton was right...)
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To: Nomorjer Kinov
"I encourage all Freepers to have their young children tested for ADD or ADHD to take advantage of the untold benefits of placating looney left wingery."

In many cases behavior problems that would lead someone to consider ADD/ADHD can be controlled by adjusting diet. The first thing I would do if I had a parent even suggest such an issue is to cut way back on my child's sugar intake.
25 posted on 11/21/2005 3:28:39 AM PST by RavenATB (Patton was right...)
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To: Angry Republican

"ADD is so horribly overused anyway."

I'd suggest that public schools are the thing that is horribly overused...


26 posted on 11/21/2005 3:29:30 AM PST by RavenATB (Patton was right...)
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To: Liberty1970
Where in the Constitution does it say Congress has the power to micro-manage school affairs? Maybe there is a problem here that needs to be addressed, but as usual the Republicans are doig virtually as poor a job as the other wing of the socialist/humanist party when it comes to governing *lawfully*.

The idea that schools are forcing children to take mind-altering addictive substances is a crime that should be stopped. If it takes a federal law to stop this, so be it. I would lock up school officials for 10 years for doing this. This isn't micro-managing, this is protection of basic rights of parents and children.

27 posted on 11/21/2005 3:38:27 AM PST by Always Right
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To: ChildOfThe60s

If you live in Cali, your exempt.


28 posted on 11/21/2005 4:33:42 AM PST by wolfcreek
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To: petitfour

I think that you're right. This isn't an issue in Texas, and I've taught pre-school, elementary school, and middle school. Parents decide to take their child off of ritalin [or whatever]-- that's their business. I had a parent tell me in August that she knew her child had difficulties [shuffling papers, digging in her backpack, twiddling, etc., constantly] but she wasn't going to put her on medication. [That's fine, I wouldn't put my child on ritalin, either-- and nothing else works reliably.] As long as parents understand their child's behaviors and what the trade-offs are, it's a problem that can be dealt with.


29 posted on 11/21/2005 4:38:09 AM PST by Clara Lou
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To: Born Conservative
[Also, it sounds as though Florida's Family Service system is out of control.]


Florida's socialized dem run family service system has been and remains (along with all states) out of control and like the others, is part of the socialized public school systems in the war against God, family and country. Janet Reno wreaked many families, especially Christians, in her term preceding Clinton.
Pubs do nothing in retaliation to this illegal and immoral attack against freedom of religion.
30 posted on 11/21/2005 4:47:46 AM PST by kindred (Democrat terrorist politicians have allied with Islamic terrorists.)
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To: Amelia
We went through this scenario with the school and they suggested our child was ADD. We told them no he was not and to never suggest it again.

The problem turned out to be a teacher who didn't know how to manage her classroom. I can say this with absolute confidence as we have irrefutable proof.

Teachers are under so much pressure to make the children perform at an early age they are willing to drug their students to get the desired result. What they need to understand is that children are SUPPOSED to be hyper in the early years of their lives.

Our child is doing excellent in school now and has surpassed many of his classmates. We attribute the change to a better teacher.

31 posted on 11/21/2005 6:24:20 AM PST by RockyMtnMan
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To: ChildOfThe60s
They can't do that in my area. The ONE teacher that did here got dealt with pretty severely. I sure haven't done that for any kids in my class. Any med-taking has been parent initiated and NOT suggested by me nor any other school or administration staff. Besides, I and many other teachers simply don't have the TIME to make sure 25 kids all take their medicine.

I agree with the premise and aim of the bill, but often something like this brings out the teacher bashers. A similiar thing happened here last year when the teacher bashers came out in force and said we were drugging the kids like crazy (without one example) and forgetting that we AREN'T allowed to do so.

Teachers shouldn't be in the business of drugging kids. Any "condition" should be on a case by case basis and the parents should have any final say.

32 posted on 11/21/2005 9:20:42 AM PST by moog
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To: petitfour

Let state legislatures decide this sort of thing.

I would agree with that.


33 posted on 11/21/2005 9:21:29 AM PST by moog
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To: Amelia

"My experience has been that parents are more likely to want their children labeled ADD/ADHD than teachers are"

A lot of teachers would probably say the same. That has been my experience too.


34 posted on 11/21/2005 9:22:50 AM PST by moog
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To: ChildOfThe60s

because the school demanded that all kids in 1st grade take a nap each day.

For that reason????? Actually, a little nap wouldn't hurt some of my first grade students now and then. Then again, they get that anyway from listening to their boring teacher talk:).


35 posted on 11/21/2005 9:24:38 AM PST by moog
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To: ChildOfThe60s

It is the NEA they are beholden to.

Must be in the eyes of the beholder.


36 posted on 11/21/2005 9:25:04 AM PST by moog
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To: SauronOfMordor

My antenna went up at this

Martian discrimination I think is what it was!!


37 posted on 11/21/2005 9:25:55 AM PST by moog
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To: Sunana

needed aide they require to perform to their potential

No ADD student has ever gotten an aide in my school.


38 posted on 11/21/2005 9:27:52 AM PST by moog
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To: RavenATB

I'd suggest that public schools are the thing that is horribly overused...

I know, my dad used them eight times for his kids. We all turned out "terrible....."


39 posted on 11/21/2005 9:29:24 AM PST by moog
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To: Clara Lou

had a parent tell me in August that she knew her child had difficulties

Here, the decision to medicate the child often is based by the parent on how the child acts at HOME.


40 posted on 11/21/2005 9:30:30 AM PST by moog
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To: RockyMtnMan

Teachers are under so much pressure to make the children perform at an early age they are willing to drug their students to get the desired result.

I give my students tainted orange juice every day.


41 posted on 11/21/2005 9:31:32 AM PST by moog
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To: moog

Sounds funny doesn't it? Homeschooling to avoid naps. Crazier than being a religious kook, huh?

Seriously, she was/is extremely strong willed and we knew it would be impossible to for she and the system to get along with each other. Absolutely no flexibility in decision making in the schools here then (and now).

In addition, she was operating at a 3rd grade level at that point anyway, so we knew 1st grade was out of the question. Considering the quality of education here, it just wasn't worth the effort to get along with our local school system. I had a lot of close dealings with them several years later and believe me, any criticisms I make are very accurate.


42 posted on 11/21/2005 10:19:22 AM PST by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s......you weren't really there.)
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To: ChildOfThe60s
Sounds funny doesn't it? Homeschooling to avoid naps. Crazier than being a religious kook, huh? Seriously, she was/is extremely strong willed and we knew it would be impossible to for she and the system to get along with each other. Absolutely no flexibility in decision making in the schools here then (and now). In addition, she was operating at a 3rd grade level at that point anyway, so we knew 1st grade was out of the question. Considering the quality of education here, it just wasn't worth the effort to get along with our local school system. I had a lot of close dealings with them several years later and believe me, any criticisms I make are very accurate.

All of my siblings and I worked at several grades above grade level in elementary school. Some of us went on to gifted programs. Others of us did not, but all of us got quality educations because that's what my parents expected of us. In my own class (after a little less than three months), I have several children on a grade above level or higher (one is on a fifth grade level). It is a challenge to keep them all satisfied, but I expect different levels and things from each student. It also depends a lot on the student's and parents' attitudes.

The statements I make are accurate as well because they are based on my own and my family's experiences over 30 plus years. They are things I see happen with my own eyes. Nonetheless, I do not make blanket statments because I know that situations are different in different areas and even in individual situations.

You do sound like a good father and good luck in your efforts.

Just joshing about the naps part. Josh likes to take naps anyways.

BTW--I'm on a vacation break because of the year-round schedules we have here--not just monkeying around:).

43 posted on 11/21/2005 10:29:24 AM PST by moog
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