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N.C. judge dismisses voting machine case; vendor may pull out
CentreDaily.com ^ | November 29, 2005 | Staff reporter

Posted on 11/29/2005 12:19:42 PM PST by Zuben Elgenubi

N.C. judge dismisses voting machine case; vendor may pull out


One of the nation's leading suppliers of electronic voting machines may decide against selling new equipment in North Carolina after a judge declined Monday to protect it from criminal prosecution should it fail to disclose software code as required by state law.

Diebold Inc., which makes automated teller machines and security and voting equipment, is worried it could be charged with a felony if officials determine the company failed to make all of its code -- some of which is owned by third-party software firms, including Microsoft Corp. -- available for examination by election officials in case of a voting mishap.

The requirement is part of the minimum voting equipment standards approved by state lawmakers earlier this year following the loss of more than 4,400 electronic ballots in Carteret County during the November 2004 election. The lost votes threw at least one close statewide race into uncertainty for more than two months.

About 20 North Carolina counties already use Diebold voting machines, and the State Board of Elections plans to announce Thursday the suppliers that meet the new standards. Local elections boards will be allowed to purchase voting machines from the approved vendors.

``We will obviously have no alternative but withdraw from the process,'' said Doug Hanna, a Raleigh-based lawyer representing North Canton, Ohio-based Diebold.

David Bear, a Diebold spokesman, said the company was reviewing several options after Monday's ruling. ``We're going to do what is necessary to provide what is best for our existing clients'' in North Carolina, he said.

The dispute centers on the state's requirement that suppliers place in escrow ``all software that is relevant to functionality, setup, configuration, and operation of the voting system,'' as well as a list of programmers responsible for creating the software.

That's not possible for Diebold's machines, which use Microsoft Windows, Hanna said. The company does not have the right to provide Microsoft's code, he said, adding it would be impossible to provide the names of every programmer who worked on Windows.

The State Board of Elections has told potential suppliers to provide code for all available software and explain why some is unavailable. That's not enough of an assurance for Diebold, which remains concerned about breaking a law that's punishable by a low-grade felony and a civil penalty of up to $100,000 per violation.

``You cannot have a statute that imposes a criminal violation ... without being clear about what conduct will submit you to a criminal violation,'' Hanna said.

But because no one has yet to accuse Diebold of breaking the law, Wake County Superior Court Judge Narley Cashwell declined to issue an injunction that would have protected the company from prosecution. Cashwell also declined to offer an interpretation of the law that would have allayed Diebold's concerns.

``We need to comply with the literal language and the statute,'' Cashwell said. ``I don't think we have an issue here yet.''

Diebold machines were blamed for voting disruptions in a California primary election last year. California has refused to certify some machines because of their malfunction rate. California officials have agreed to let a computer expert attempt to hack into Diebold machines to examine how secure they are.

On Monday, California Secretary of State Bruce McPherson said his office might seek to expand such testing to all systems seeking certification for use in California's 58 counties.

Diebold shares fell 71 cents, or 1.8 percent, to close at $38.93 Monday on the New York Stock Exchange.

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More technology news and opinion at www.siliconvalley.com


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Front Page News; Government; Politics/Elections; US: North Carolina
KEYWORDS: diebold; votingmachine
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The Diebold voting machine takes a solid left to the head.
1 posted on 11/29/2005 12:19:43 PM PST by Zuben Elgenubi
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To: Alia; Constitution Day; TaxRelief

NC ping


2 posted on 11/29/2005 12:23:44 PM PST by azhenfud (He who always is looking up seldom finds others' lost change.)
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To: Zuben Elgenubi

While code dealing with voting and tabulation should be available, I can't see that the operating system code has any relevance.

That said, I dislike these computer voting machines. I've been a programmer, and know that I could bury routines in code that could manipulate results. I doubt that anyone would find them or any evidence that they ever existed.

It's hard enough to keep track of code if you're writing it, much less examining someone else's code. Just about every program has abandoned or nonfunctional blocks of code in it. Those are the places to hide stuff. In any case, there is just way too much chance of fraud when computers are involved. I don't like them for elections. In fact, I'd like to see hand counts exclusively.


3 posted on 11/29/2005 12:25:36 PM PST by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: Zuben Elgenubi

Anyone know what party Narley Cashwell belongs to, or what his record is? I found a couple of his cases on-line, but no biography.

A Narley Cashwell is listed as a policeman and as Vice President of the Patrolmen's Benevolent Association. I don't know if this is the judge at an earlier time, or maybe his son? Probably his son, since the website appears to have been updated in 2005.

http://www.ncpba.org/raleigh-wake(new).htm


4 posted on 11/29/2005 12:29:17 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: Zuben Elgenubi

They ought to be forced to disclose their tabulation codes for all to see.


5 posted on 11/29/2005 12:36:38 PM PST by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: TaxRelief; Alia; 100%FEDUP; 2ndMostConservativeBrdMember; ~Vor~; A2J; a4drvr; Adder; Aegedius; ...

NC *Ping*

Please FRmail Constitution Day, TaxRelief OR Alia if you want to be added to or removed from this North Carolina ping list.
6 posted on 11/29/2005 12:39:38 PM PST by Constitution Day
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To: MineralMan

Yep. An easier solution is to have a hard printout that is viewable after the voter is finished for postive verification. That way every machine can be verified after the election for monkey business.


7 posted on 11/29/2005 12:40:19 PM PST by Blood of Tyrants (G-d is not a Republican. But Satan is definitely a Democrat.)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

We fill in the circle next to the name with a Sharpie. Works every time. But...wasn't it the Democrats who demanded these voting machines after Floriduh in 2000?


8 posted on 11/29/2005 12:44:34 PM PST by massgopguy (massgopguy)
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To: MineralMan
"That said, I dislike these computer voting machines. I've been a programmer, and know that I could bury routines in code that could manipulate results. I doubt that anyone would find them or any evidence that they ever existed. "

I disagree. The military has been writing programs to control highly sensitive combat systems, including nuke systems for a very long time. Not only the military, but banking applications, casinos, and pretty much every other application that deals with money all have measures to find hidden routines.
Someone should be able to write a counter program and secure it.
With minimal effort you can secure sensitive applications.

If we really want to crack down on fraud, the place to do it is before you even get to the machine.

I do agree on the operating system being irrelevant, although I can't help chuckling at the thought of Diebold pulling up the NC courthouse with 50 18-wheelers filled with a hard copy of the Windows source code, or the look on faces the 2 "experts" NC hires to go through it all.
9 posted on 11/29/2005 12:46:03 PM PST by tfecw (It's for the children)
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To: Zuben Elgenubi
The Diebold voting machine takes a solid left to the head.

WOOO-HOOO!!! :-)

10 posted on 11/29/2005 12:47:40 PM PST by Gondring (I'll give up my right to die when hell freezes over my dead body!)
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To: Zuben Elgenubi

The best voting machines I have seen are optical scan type. Then again, that would require someone to be able to READ the ballot.


11 posted on 11/29/2005 12:49:14 PM PST by BoBToMatoE
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To: Blood of Tyrants

"Yep. An easier solution is to have a hard printout that is viewable after the voter is finished for postive verification. That way every machine can be verified after the election for monkey business."




I agree completely. If they're going to use computers for voting machines, then a hard copy printout of each voters choices should be an absolute requirement. Let the voter take it home with him/her.

Still, I have no doubt that I could code around all of that and manipulate a tabulation. So could any really competent programmer. Whoever the state will be hiring to look at these programs will have had nothing to do with writing them. Knowing that, I could bury routines to manipulate a tabulation, scattering lines of code throughout the program, making them look like they actually functioned in another routine, but really operating together as a hidden subroutine, doing pretty much whatever I wanted them to do.

Nobody but someone who knew the program could find them. And I doubt if the government is capable of hiring a really competent person to do the review of the code in the first place.

Of course, my programs were written solely by me, and my programming style is, shall we say, unorthodox. One of my applications was over 150,000 lines of code, all uncommented. I didn't need the comments, so I didn't put them in. Over several revisions, the thing got pretty complex, internally. I'm quite certain that not another soul could have figured out how the thing worked.

This was in Visual Basic, up to version 3.0, where you could use undeclared Global variables. The program had over 400 of them. I knew them all, but since they were undeclared, I can't imagine how anyone else would figure it out.

Yes, I'm a sloppy, sloppy programmer. Never mind. That program worked very, very well, and sold quite well, too.


12 posted on 11/29/2005 12:50:24 PM PST by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: Zuben Elgenubi

This is the one place where I think open source software is an absolute necessity. I don't trust my vote to a machine with no paper trail where the public can't know what the code underneath is doing.


13 posted on 11/29/2005 12:54:34 PM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: tfecw

"I can't help chuckling at the thought of Diebold pulling up the NC courthouse with 50 18-wheelers filled with a hard copy of the Windows source code, or the look on faces the 2 "experts" NC hires to go through it all."




That is an amusing thought, indeed. I imagine that half of the Windows source code is indecipherable, even to Microsoft, these days.

How many hundreds of people have had their hands into the code that makes up Windows, I wonder? Maybe thousands. Most of them are no longer even at Microsoft.

I stopped programming when Windows 95 came out. I coded solely in Visual Basic, and had six applications in the shareware market. All did pretty darned well, and were very functional.

I was really careful not to code past Microsoft's recommendations, and paid a lot of attention to advisories about using certain calls to DLLs. The result? All of those programs still work perfectly in Windows XP, even though they are sort of hogs of processor cycles due to a lack of multi-threading.

I'm blown away at Microsoft's attention to backwards compatibility. These things, last compiled in 1994, should not run at all in XP. Yet, they do, and without a single hitch.

Amazing!


14 posted on 11/29/2005 12:57:10 PM PST by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: MineralMan
Good lord, no. The potential for fraud in that "voter takes a printout home" is 100%. Imagine a whole bunch of people showing up with slips of paper "proving" the count was off? There will be no chain of custody and therefore the slips cannot be collected to do a recount but an operator sure could trash an election. Don't think the receipts can be counterfeited? Remember that most election fraud involves the workers in the election office. No, optical scan should be the only method allowed as the uniform auditable voting system for all.
15 posted on 11/29/2005 12:58:52 PM PST by NonValueAdded (The honorable Richard Cheney, X man!!!)
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To: MineralMan; Blood of Tyrants
Still, I have no doubt that I could code around all of that and manipulate a tabulation.

A few years ago IIRC Hughes decided to stop all those with pirated cards for their satellites. Instead of downloading a program that would be caught by the pirates and circumvented, they downloaded small regular updates that included some stray code.

A final update had another bit of code in it that brought all the previous stray code bits together, forming a program that destroyed the card.

It's easy to hide stuff.

16 posted on 11/29/2005 12:59:40 PM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: Blood of Tyrants

Put a routine in that makes the machine print the opposite of the vote tallied and you can still have chaos.


17 posted on 11/29/2005 1:00:51 PM PST by Almondjoy
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To: Blood of Tyrants

That certainly would help their competitors cut back on their R & D.


18 posted on 11/29/2005 1:04:36 PM PST by Cyber Liberty (© 2005, Ravin' Lunatic since 4/98)
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To: NonValueAdded

"Good lord, no. The potential for fraud in that "voter takes a printout home" is 100%."

Oh, I didn't mean that those would be used in tabulations, ever. I just would like a copy of what the machine recorded as my vote. Some other secure form of hard copy would be needed for recounts, for sure.


19 posted on 11/29/2005 1:05:08 PM PST by MineralMan (godless atheist)
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To: Cicero
Working on political affilitation, Cicero. I must be googling the same resource as you. But I did try the image google and got

Will get back to you on affiliation if I find anything.

20 posted on 11/29/2005 1:05:57 PM PST by Zuben Elgenubi
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