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To: cynicom

Amen to that--just wait until Hillary gets control of the reigns @ the White House & uses the Patriot Act against us! That is a scary thought.

Eliminating the Patriot Act could help a little bit in controlling her lust for power.


24 posted on 12/16/2005 11:30:25 AM PST by libertyman ("....It's [the Constitution] just a g-ddamned piece of paper" --Presidebt Bush, Nov. '05)
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To: libertyman

Seems to me should could sic the IRS on her opponents even without the Patriot Act. Believe me, they wouldn't be worried if something was legal or not per the Patriot Act. It would be like gun-control laws to a criminal.


25 posted on 12/16/2005 11:32:06 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: libertyman
One has only to read the hysterical posts here on this thread to see that the American sheep are indeed asleep.

If this were Bill Clinton and the democrats that were pushing for the bill these same people would be raging from the rooftops in opposition.

The Government may make all the laws they desire but they will not stop evil people with intent to do us harm. Instead these unwise laws can and will be used against anyone and everyone that the Government desires.

These foolish people are looking for guaranteed security and, that will never happen.

60 posted on 12/16/2005 12:10:40 PM PST by cynicom
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To: libertyman

"Amen to that--just wait until Hillary gets control of the reigns @ the White House & uses the Patriot Act against us! That is a scary thought."

Why is that a scary thought? Can you explain, based on legal knowledge and reading of the Patriot Act itself, and not some pundit's talking points?

You are opposed to us being able to get one wiretap warrant that applies to any phone a terrorism suspect can use, and not just one of his/her phones?

You are oppposed to computer communications being included in electronic transmissions that investigators can get access to, when those transmissions are related to a terrorism suspect they have obtained warrants to investigate?

You are opposed to the sharing of grand jury information that involves foreign intelligence or counterintelligence with federal law enforcement, intelligence, protective, immigration, national defense or national security officials?

You oppose foreign intelligence or counterintelligence officers sharing foreign intelligence information obtained as part of a criminal investigation with law enforcement?

You oppose an increased amount of time that federal officials may watch people they suspect are spies or terrorists, on properly obtained warrants?

You oppose the seizure of voicemail messages under a warrant in a terrorism investigation?

You oppose court authorized warrants for Internet service providers and other electronic communication and remote computing service providers to hand over records and e-mails to federal officials in emergency situations, given the courts attestation as to the nature of the emergency (terrorist XYZ just told us a nuke is coming in at....!!!)?

You oppose federal officials obtaining "tangible items" like business records, including those from libraries and bookstores, for foreign intelligence and international terrorism investigations, just as they had previously been allowed to do in organized crime and inter-state fraud investigations?

You oppose intercepting the wire or electronic communication of a computer hacker or intruder in certain circumstances in terrorism investigations?

You oppose federal officials being able to wiretap or watch suspects if foreign intelligence gathering is a "significant purpose" for seeking a Federal Intelligence Surveillance Act order? The pre-Patriot Act standard said officials could ask for the surveillance only if it was "the" sole or main purpose.

You oppose approval of nationwide service of search warrants for electronic evidence in terrorism cases?

Why do you oppose each of these provisions. Do you understand the legal and judicial checks that are required in each of them?


61 posted on 12/16/2005 12:12:00 PM PST by Wuli
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