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Keep Darwin's 'lies' out of Polish schools: education official
AFP via Yahoo! News ^ | October 14, 2006

Posted on 10/14/2006 11:16:50 AM PDT by lizol

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To: Jaguarbhzrd

God is scientifically illiterate, I see.

Ah, the cult of Darwinism. Lots of othewise decent people sucked into its fable of frog to prince....


261 posted on 10/15/2006 1:41:54 PM PDT by Theo (Global warming "scientists." Pro-evolution "scientists." They're both wrong.)
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To: 1000 silverlings
Matthew 5:11

Here we see a basic, and very revealing, problem. The subject is whether the ToE and/or ID should be in science classes. When the response to the defense of ToE is scripture, it shows that the opposition is there for religious, not scientific, reasons.

Therefore, your side of the discussion by default loses, since you are not talking science anymore.

262 posted on 10/15/2006 1:43:42 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: DaveLoneRanger
If you believe in evolution, how can you conclude anything BUT?

Because that conclusion doesn't logically follow.

263 posted on 10/15/2006 1:45:42 PM PDT by curiosity
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To: freedumb2003
I see we have degenerated into Scripture

Leave FR, then, if you have such a distain for the Word of God. Go back to DU; you'll feel right at home.

264 posted on 10/15/2006 1:46:37 PM PDT by Theo (Global warming "scientists." Pro-evolution "scientists." They're both wrong.)
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To: stultorum
"Christianity gave rise to the greatest civilization of all times and all that is known in science.

Really? So there were no atheistic or agnostic or Muslim or Hindu or other religion's contributions to the current state of science?

All those Christians based their scientific work on their religious belief system?

"Other religions gave some, but only because they fed on the benevolence of Christianity.

So even if scientists have different beliefs than Christianity it is really Christianity which drives their contributions.

Instead of blindly believing your revisionist version of history perhaps you should investigate it a bit further.

265 posted on 10/15/2006 2:00:25 PM PDT by b_sharp (evolution is not, generally speaking, a global optimiser, but a general satisficer -J. Wilkins)
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To: StevieJ; stultorum; unspun
"Wow. To dismiss in a single sentence the immense body of scientific work carried out before zero AD by the Romans, Greeks, Egyptians and Chinese (amongst others) is breathtaking in its ignorance."

Isn't it though?

On another thread there is a poster who is complaining that Science and its supporters are arrogant. I wonder what he would make of this?

266 posted on 10/15/2006 2:05:46 PM PDT by b_sharp (evolution is not, generally speaking, a global optimiser, but a general satisficer -J. Wilkins)
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To: sirchtruth
"No, I will accept it if you can you point out the last significant "change" and about when it occured in man?"

Why that particular condition?

267 posted on 10/15/2006 2:07:36 PM PDT by b_sharp (evolution is not, generally speaking, a global optimiser, but a general satisficer -J. Wilkins)
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To: A. Pole
"I do not mean actual Darwin. I mean "Darwinism" as it is being propagated today."

You are aware I hope that the 'Darwinism' presented by your local creationist is a strawman which does not resemble the current state of Evolutionary science.

268 posted on 10/15/2006 2:11:42 PM PDT by b_sharp (evolution is not, generally speaking, a global optimiser, but a general satisficer -J. Wilkins)
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To: Theo
Leave FR, then, if you have such a distain for the Word of God. Go back to DU; you'll feel right at home.

FR is not a Religious site -- it is a Conservative site. Scripture is fine on f-religion, but here where we are discussing issues of science it is inappropriate (and irrelevant).

Willful ignorancre is NOT a Conservative Value.

Or do you speak for JR?

269 posted on 10/15/2006 2:23:30 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (ID: bad science, bad theology and, above all, bad philology)
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To: Theo
God is scientifically illiterate, I see.

No, people are.

Ah, the cult of Darwinism. Lots of othewise decent people sucked into its fable of frog to prince....

So you won't even try to mount a decent reasonable argument supporting your position.

Willful Ignorance AND Logical Fallacies: The CR/IDers' stovck in trade.

270 posted on 10/15/2006 2:26:01 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (ID: bad science, bad theology and, above all, bad philology)
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To: Tribune7
Thank God for our enemies :-)

Indeed. God has graced us with people who don't even pretend to understand science and who look like the Righty Moonbats.

If it wasn't going to make scientific illiterates out of the next generation and splash over to those of who DO understand science, it would be quite laughable.

I have to assume that Fundamentalism dabbling in science is proof God has a sense of humor.

271 posted on 10/15/2006 2:28:34 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (ID: bad science, bad theology and, above all, bad philology)
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To: antiRepublicrat
Big difference -- scientists have been working on the ToE for over a hundred years, and have not yet been able to show it to be wrong.

Of course not. All the evidence related to the big picture is circumstantial. Even in a judicial context circumstantial evidence is not exactly held in high regard. Why do evolutionists have to elevate circumstantial evidence to the level of certitude not warranted, and then go on to insist their version of history is worthy of an exclusive hearing in public schools? Again, evolution has only been directly observed within limits. Extrapolations from there qualify better as philosophies of history than as science.

ID is not a scientific theory.

Spoken frequently and fervently, to be sure. Yet there are ample examples of directly observed intelligent design, which makes the process far from necessarily "supernatural" and beyond the purview of science.

272 posted on 10/15/2006 2:30:15 PM PDT by Fester Chugabrew
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To: curiosity
Yes, I reject that view.

Then we might agree. But I would like you to explain why and how exactly you reject this view( "that the universe is a dead purposeless machine ruled by chance")

I'd also add that it has absolutely nothing to do with the modern neo-Darwinian theory of evolution.

Perhaps. The problem is that this suuposed theory is not really defined. When you deal with a scientific theory like the one of Newton or Darwin or Einstein you need the name of the author, the title, date and place of original publication. And first of all, the explicit claims of the theory. Otherwise it is impossible to debate it.

Can you provide these details?

273 posted on 10/15/2006 2:30:15 PM PDT by A. Pole (" There is no other god but Free Market, and Adam Smith is his prophet ! Bazaar Akbar! ")
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To: freedumb2003

Freedumb2003...you stated,

"FR is not a Religious site -- it is a Conservative site"

Well, I am glad that is cleared up...


274 posted on 10/15/2006 2:33:14 PM PDT by andysandmikesmom
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To: andysandmikesmom
Well, I am glad that is cleared up...

Thanks -- every now and then we have to remind ourselves.

275 posted on 10/15/2006 2:35:38 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (ID: bad science, bad theology and, above all, bad philology)
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To: Fester Chugabrew
. Yet there are ample examples of directly observed intelligent design, which makes the process far from necessarily "supernatural" and beyond the purview of science.

Just because you don't understand it, that doesn't make a process ID -- it just means you don't understand it.

Or for a better quote: "What does god need with a starship?"

276 posted on 10/15/2006 2:36:51 PM PDT by freedumb2003 (ID: bad science, bad theology and, above all, bad philology)
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To: curiosity
"I do not mean actual Darwin." Okay. So do you broadly accept Darwin's theory as the best, empirically-verified scientific explanation for the origin of species and biological diversity?

No, I see the Darwin's theory same way as Lamarck theory. They were XIX century attempts at explaining life in evolutionary and natural terms.

"I mean 'Darwinism' as it is being propagated today."

Where is this "Darwinism" of yours being propagated?

In media in debate and from mouths of atheists who peddle the idea of random mutation.

Surely this "Darwinism" you speak of cannot be the same thing as the modern neo-Darwinian theory of biological evolution as it is commonly taught in modern biology courses.

When you study REAL scientific data, you see concrete amazing discoveries like DNA, retroviruses etc ... You do not see any unifying theory yet.

I have looked at many textbooks on evolutionary biology, and I have yet to see one that claims the universe is a "dead purposeless machine."

Of course not. It would be a give away, don't you think? :)

277 posted on 10/15/2006 2:37:22 PM PDT by A. Pole (" There is no other god but Free Market, and Adam Smith is his prophet ! Bazaar Akbar! ")
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To: lizol

What a shame that a Catholic would reject the teachings of the Catholic Church that accept evolution.


278 posted on 10/15/2006 2:40:48 PM PDT by DaGman
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To: freedumb2003
Just because you don't understand it, that doesn't make a process ID -- it just means you don't understand it.

Just because you don't understand it, that doesn't make a process ID supernatural, religious, or unscientific -- it just means you don't understand it.

279 posted on 10/15/2006 2:42:28 PM PDT by Fester Chugabrew
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To: b_sharp
Why that particular condition?

My understanding of what science does is "observe" before they form hypothesis. Since evolution of man has never been "observed", nor has there ever been any intermediate species still alive, ever shown, I'm wondering how science concludes evolution is "fact?"

280 posted on 10/15/2006 2:42:33 PM PDT by sirchtruth (No one has the RIGHT not to be offended...)
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