Eastwood keeps it a little too real in ‘Flags’

In the book, didn't Sobel (the real one) commit suicide around 1950?
I'll have to read it again, it was agreat book.

101 posted on 10/19/2006 11:59:54 AM PDT by Lx (Do you like it, do you like it. Scott? I call it Mr. and Mrs. Tennerman chili.)

I think you missed the point! LOL! Excessive not absent...

102 posted on 10/19/2006 12:01:15 PM PDT by carton253 (Sadness is just another word for not enough chocolate.)

This book was written by James Bradley who discovered that his father was one of the men who raised the flag when he was going thru his father's things after his death. His father never spoke of it. Unlike Did you know I served in Viet Nam Kerry.

His father joined the Navy so he wouldn't be an infantryman slogging thru mud, became a Corpman and was assigned to the Marines. Bradley made it his mission to track down any of the surviving flag raisers, to learn their stories and to learn first hand about the battle from as many surviving Marines as he could. It was a very tough book to read, but I figured if they could live it, I could read it. Hope the film does it justice.

103 posted on 10/19/2006 12:01:43 PM PDT by GoldwaterChick (Never give in, never give in, never, never, never give in. Winston Churchill, October 29, 1941)

I had heard he committed suicide.

104 posted on 10/19/2006 12:02:05 PM PDT by dfwgator

"That's the sort of attitude that leads to deaths like those on the set of Twilight Zone The Movie."

Bull. There is a difference between getting injured by a nearby explosion which gives an actor an "owie" and walking into the rotor of a helicopter.

105 posted on 10/19/2006 12:03:07 PM PDT by lawdude (The dems see Wal-Mart as a bigger threat to the US than muslim terrorists)

This is a sticky subject. And the counter-question is, might we soon see a Spielberg- or Eastwood-directed German-version of the events that took place at Oradour, or perhaps a German-version of the Eastern Front exploits of 5th SS Panzerdivision Viking? Or, 61 years from now, an American-directed Muslim-version of the events that took place on 9/11? Or in Baghdad? Or Tora Bora? Will our grandchildren be buying Iranian cars?

Nothing wrong with improving relations with Japan, mind you: But if one remembers recent history, for every 100 Allied prisoners taken by the Germans, three perished; for every 100 prisoners taken by the Japanese, 37 died.

The Japanese still staunchly remember Hiroshima, Nagasaki, and the Tokyo fireraids of March 1945, though they have indeed largely failed to tell their schoolchildren anything of the war beyond these--and the effort to obfuscate in Japan appears to have been intentional through the decades.

We returned Iwo to the Japanese in '68, and Okinawa in '72--and though Okinawa has periodically been under Japanese rule through the centuries, it never was truly Japanese (see George Kerr's "Okinawa: The History of an Island People"). Also appears as if U.S. troops may permanently be departing that island for Guam within the coming years.

Oddly enough, I'm of the impression--incorrectly or otherwise--that the U.S. is still getting the short end of the stick in its relations with Japan--and all because we may ultimately need that country in the event of a potential conflict with China. And of course we all know what happened in China between 1937-45, and who bore a significant brunt of the fighting against Japan during the Asiatic-Pacific War. I do hope that in passionately studying Kuribayashi, Clint has in fact devoted at least a little time to Iris Chang's "The Rape of Nanking."

One of our Iwo survivors noted that the upcoming film is perhaps more about money than reality, and I'm strongly inclined to agree. But I'm also willing to go a step further in saying that I similarly think that there are unspoken political motivations/considerations behind the making of this movie.

I greatly admire James Bradley (actually had the pleasure of meeting him once), and I similarly admire both George Bush Sr., and his son. But I also understand that the three are friends. Bradley's first book took a somewhat anti-Japanese tone; his second a decidedly softer one toward our former enemy. Just after "Flyboys" hit the bookshelves, I noted that President Bush (Sr.) was quick to say, "The war was long ago; the Japanese are no longer our enemies."

Indeed, they're not: But I do hope that, in courting their favor today, we aren't positioning ourselves to undergo a whitewash of history in order to make everyone feel good. As Lincoln once rightly observed, you can't please everyone all the time, and you certainly shouldn't attempt to do so for the wrong reasons or short-term political expediency. John Bradley was a fine human being, and probably a very forgiving one: But, if you'll remember, he never let his memories of Ralph Ignatowski stray too far, and neither was he willing to allow the passage of "time [to blur] the jagged contours of Japan's Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere...." (See William Manchester's "American Caesar" - p257)

Sorry for the windiness. Hope I haven't offended anyone with this observation. Just a thought.

106 posted on 10/19/2006 12:08:58 PM PDT by jonesboheim

I had to put up with celebrities such as the incredibly spoiled "JLo" when she came to Germany.

One of the bubble head Hollywood starlets (can't recall her name, but I never heard of her) is in Pittsburgh now filming a movie and started the "Do you know who I am" crap with a doorman/bouncer at a local club. She told him, "I'm so and so, the actress" and he replied "Nice to meet you. I'm Joe and I'm for real, and if you don't have ID, you don't get in."

107 posted on 10/19/2006 12:14:27 PM PDT by Ditto

"Do you know who I am"

The classic answer is "If you have to ask that then you're nobody."

108 posted on 10/19/2006 12:20:32 PM PDT by Locomotive Breath (In the shuffling madness)

Depends on the meaning of "nearby".

Live explosives are dangerous and those working around them should be informed.

109 posted on 10/19/2006 12:21:48 PM PDT by weegee (Remember "Remember the Maine"? Well in the current war "Remember the Baby Milk Factory")

Actually I appreciated your post.

110 posted on 10/19/2006 12:24:24 PM PDT by weegee (Remember "Remember the Maine"? Well in the current war "Remember the Baby Milk Factory")

Good gosh, I never heard that! I was in the Navy, and we..well...swore like sailors...

I never had any expectation that any other branch, in war or peace would have spoken any other way!

111 posted on 10/19/2006 12:26:04 PM PDT by rlmorel (Islamofacism: It is all fun and games until someone puts an eye out. Or chops off a head.)

To: Locomotive Breath

I went to work for GE after I got back from my Asian Vacation. The guy I worked for was on Iwo, a BAR man. He said he lasted 7 Minuit's, his ammo humper was KIA and so was most of his squad. He met his wife in the hospital, had four kids and was the most unflappable person I ever met.

112 posted on 10/19/2006 12:28:49 PM PDT by Little Bill (A 37%'r, a Red Spot on a Blue State, rats are evil.)

Well if you make it though something like that and aren't insane then I guess there's nothing much afterwards that can bother you. Vets get far too little credit for what they've been through. I'm glad movies like this are around to remind the rest of us.

113 posted on 10/19/2006 12:35:43 PM PDT by Locomotive Breath (In the shuffling madness)

To: You Dirty Rats

Good afternoon.
"I don't see how it could be done in four hours."

It couldn't, but Spielberg showed us with 'Band of Brothers' how the story could be told.

Michael Frazier

114 posted on 10/19/2006 12:37:37 PM PDT by brazzaville (no surrender no retreat, well, maybe retreat's ok)

Good gosh...were you in the navy in the 1940's?

115 posted on 10/19/2006 12:47:11 PM PDT by carton253 (Sadness is just another word for not enough chocolate.)

To: Locomotive Breath

I have kind of noticed the same thing over the years as a Supervisor and Manager. There is reality and that which is perceived as reality.

Being a Grunt in a War Zone is reality, having a Female Manager in PMS mode or some Kid sucking his way up the ladder is not. Having been shot at a few times gives you a perspective, you become a leveler able to cut through the hype.

116 posted on 10/19/2006 12:57:24 PM PDT by Little Bill (A 37%'r, a Red Spot on a Blue State, rats are evil.)

To: Locomotive Breath

I have an uncle who was in the 101st and was sent to Bastogne. My aunt said he refused to talk about it. The only story she ever got out of him was that as he came over a hill with a five man squad, a burst of machine gun fire killed the other four and missed him.

I have a family friend, who lives down the road from my parents, who was also in the 101st. Another FRiend (an author) wrote a short piece about his WW2 service and life. Here is the piece from his website.

117 posted on 10/19/2006 1:01:40 PM PDT by Jackknife ( "It's not a real party 'til somebody breaks something.")

To: GoldwaterChick

Unlike Did you know I served in Viet Nam Kerry.

He did? Golly! I didn't know that!

Maybe if he'd mentioned that during his campaign, he might've gotten more votes!

Ah, the virtues of 20/20 hindsight.

118 posted on 10/19/2006 1:05:33 PM PDT by uglybiker (Don't look at me. I didn't make you stupid.)

119 posted on 10/19/2006 1:14:42 PM PDT by Locomotive Breath (In the shuffling madness)

Realistic move about the Battle of the Bulge?

You HAVE to see Band of Brothers...the whole series.

120 posted on 10/19/2006 1:17:02 PM PDT by Mariner

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