[nathanbedford]

Two years ago, in January 2002, I published this comment which you might find relevant to this article. It attempts to treat of the liberal compulsion to jerk every lever in their quest not just for the betterment of man's condition but for the perfectibility of man himself. In the long run, these preposterous excesses are not really the result of fears over litigation, they are the inevitable consequences of the liberal mindset which sees your child in school as only another chicken in a Skinner box.

GOD AND MAN IN THE SKINNER BOX

Attending college in the 60's, I was exposed to the writings of BF Skinner in a mandatory Psychology 101 class. At the time I was struck by the time and energy the department devoted to this man and his theories. Essentially, he put a chicken in a box and taught it to play baseball by rewarding it with feed. When the chicken pressed a lever on cue, or ran a base, it got a pellet. Skinner was able to train animals to a remarkable degree with this method of positive reinforcement. He also demonstrated that negative reinforcement, such as electric shocks, was not as effective as positive reinforcement in controlling animal behavior.

So far, Skinner has not done the world much harm and perhaps he has even contributed something useful if you are Siegfried and Roy. But it soon became clear that Skinner and my psych professors had ambitions grander than dog and pony shows when they required a reading of Skinner's Walden Two. Here Skinner extrapolates his findings from chickens to people and causes real mischief. Essentially, he postulates that the humsn animal is a TABULA RASA, neither good nor evil, which can be conditioned into good behavior. There are no evil people just poorly conditioned behavior. All that is required to have generations of well behaved human chickens is a grand enough Skinner box to positively reinforce positive behavior. Of course, it does not take a socialist to see that it would take more than a village, indeed it would take a federal burocracy, to build and maintain a big enough box.

The mischief comes in when this thinking invades the penal (whoops, I mean corrections)system or the educational establishment and so on. Praeger, in his wonderful essay, has alluded to the effects on education of this baleful presumption about the nature of man. He is absolutely right when he says: you a mess of Wu

No issue has a greater influence on determining your social and political views than whether you view human nature as basically good or not. (Praeger's comment in an article which prompted this post)

This is why liberals loathe believing christians. This is why liberals are collectivists and conservatives are individualists. This is why the Democrat party slices and dices the electorate into groups. This is why Patty Murray said what she said. The old adage that liberals love mankind in the abstract and as a group (read African-Americans) but despise them on an individual level finds its origins here. This is why believing Christians and believing Jews are finding that they hold much in common and have a common philosophical enemy in secular Jews and goyische pagans. The application of this insight is almost endless.

[BIGLOOK]

Skinner is easily refuted by George Thorogood.

B-B-B-B Bad to the Bone.

[marc costanzo]

B F Skinner's WALDEN TWO, yes, I did a comparative essay on that work with Orwell's ANIMAL FARM .

Problem was there was no comparison to be made with the two tomes .

Their conclusions were completely different and their characters had no parallels with each other .

Only a basis in Secular Utopian Writing- but that is where the concepts end - -

[Earthdweller]

"No issue has a greater influence on determining your social and political views than whether you view human nature as basically good or not. (Praeger's comment in an article which prompted this post)"

Most people know (even if subconsciously) that all their fellow earth travelers can be both "good" and "bad" at any given moment in time. (I just had to throw a wrench in perfection, LOL.)

Social and political views should reflect the use of Skinner as a carrot and Freud as a stick to be effective.

Forget the negative consequences (the rod) and spoil the child.

[Tolerance Sucks Rocks]

B.S. Skinner & Co. seem to forget that anybody can climb out of a Skinner box by simply thinking for himself (and he can stay in the Skinner box by doing the same thing, interestingly enough).

[FlyVet]

Yep, Skinner and Walden Two. I took a Behavior Analysis course in college in the late 70's. The prof was a True Believer (nice guy and excellent instructor, btw). Creation of the Utopia through behavioral science.

The Utopians fail to take into account the Pride of man, which is called the greatest sin. Those who rise to power will become full of it, and they will have to deal with hordes of people who will not think Correctly. Reeducation camps, executions. Same old same old. They never, ever learn.

[redgolum]

No issue has a greater influence on determining your social and political views than whether you view human nature as basically good or not. (Praeger's comment in an article which prompted this post)

In my History of Western Civ. class in college, that was the main theme the professor tried to hammer home in class. Most of the students didn't quite get it. I remember when he went to great pains to point out that those who believe man is basically good have caused more harm and death then those pesky Christians who say that man is infected by sin.