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A loan that'll get ugly fast (LA Times)
LA Times ^ | Dec 11 2006 | David Streitfeld

Posted on 12/11/2006 8:58:01 AM PST by Doghouse Riley

EVERY day, Will Hertzberg owns a little less of his three-bedroom house in Corona. Like hundreds of thousands of other homeowners around the state, Hertzberg has a mortgage that lets him choose how much he pays each month. Like many of them, he always chooses to pay as little as possible.....But his debt is swelling, and his mortgage company controls his fate.

"I am rather screwed," he said.

....

Hertzberg bought his house 11 years ago for $129,995..... Comparable homes in his neighborhood fetch more than $400,000...... Over the years he has taken out $190,000 in cash through refinancings......Hertzberg's home equity paid off his credit cards, financed trips around the world that allowed him to indulge his passion for photography, bought a $32,000 Toyota Avalon and enabled some lousy investments. "Free money always has the unfortunate effect of making people go overboard," said Hertzberg, whose living room is strewn with financial publications including American Cash Flow Journal and Donald Trump's "How to Get Rich." "You'd be surprised how fast $190,000 can go."

(Excerpt) Read more at latimes.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: bubble; housing; housingbubble; realestate; schadenfreude
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To: steve8714

We have a couple of giant teardowns across from my house, and they couldn't be more soulless piles of drywall. Our house is a modest bungalow, but we love every bit of it and not only did we buy it affordable, but it's appreciated at a faster rate than the McMansions around us. We don't intend to move or "go big". Maybe a small addition - someday. But you're right - some people live in a house. I live in a home.


61 posted on 12/11/2006 10:28:57 AM PST by Rutles4Ever (The ZW radiation will not allow it. We'll both be killed that way. The medal must not be destroyed!)
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To: finnman69

Why would anyone get a loan with a pre-payment penalty? There are so many people ready to loan money.


62 posted on 12/11/2006 10:29:30 AM PST by Always Right
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To: Doghouse Riley

The rise of folks' getting pay-option loans is what suggests to me that the housing market still has a ways to fall. It may not CRASH, but it may sink 5-10% a year for years yet.


63 posted on 12/11/2006 10:31:09 AM PST by pogo101
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To: finnman69

This guy should be put in handcuffs for fraud.


64 posted on 12/11/2006 10:31:12 AM PST by Hydroshock ( (Proverbs 22:7). The rich ruleth over the poor, and the borrower is servant to the lender.)
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To: Publius Valerius
My sales approach is based upon knowledge, experience, and ethics. Also, I have 60 years of life experience, 4 houses in southern california and sleep well at night. We don't market, we have built our business on word of mouth and being good to our clients.

Best wishes.

65 posted on 12/11/2006 10:31:17 AM PST by carolinalivin
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To: glorgau

He was given the freedom to choose... and he chose poorly. How is that a "soulless" corporation's fault?


66 posted on 12/11/2006 10:31:45 AM PST by Teacher317
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To: Always Right
The longer the pre-payment penalty, the lower the interest rate.

Most of these folks plan on staying in the house 3 or more years.

If this guy sold for 390,000 he would have enough for the pre-pay and to downsize or buy another car : )

67 posted on 12/11/2006 10:33:35 AM PST by carolinalivin
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To: Rutles4Ever

You are absolutely right. My wife and I would move, but her job is in animation, and there are essentially no such jobs other than here. (I love my job too and would hate to get a new boss, but I at least *could* without changing professions. She could not.)


68 posted on 12/11/2006 10:34:15 AM PST by pogo101
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To: carolinalivin

Normally, I would say yes. I'm just not sure where we are going to go in 6 months. This could easily spiral out of control. Who knows what pressures the Dem congress will put on the Fed.

When you wrote recession in the summer, I immediately thought stagflation. I need to do more research on the current inflation pressures but I think the Fed has been late to the party and its going to cost us.


69 posted on 12/11/2006 10:36:47 AM PST by xusafflyer (Mexifornian by birth, Hoosier by choice.)
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To: APFel

Using your equity to better a debt situation, once, is one thing. It can be quite smart done right. And once.

Doing it over and over again, and spending loads of it on other things, is bad.


70 posted on 12/11/2006 10:36:52 AM PST by RockinRight (Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. He's a Socialist. And unqualified.)
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To: carolinalivin

Hey, I'm not saying that you haven't done well for yourself, but as I said earlier, you're a salesman. Your job is to put people in houses and the more expensive the house, the better for you. That's cool, that's your job. Whatever.

But, and you can call me old fashioned, I won't buy a house with a mortgage that is more than twice my salary. I believe that anything else inhibits savings and wealth accumulation.

Like I said earlier, there will be a day when the housing market flattens in California. It may be in the next couple years, it may be in the next decade. I don't know, I'm not a real estate speculator. There is no question, though, that it will flatten one day. When that day comes, I know this: all those people in those big, fancy houses that have ARMs are going to be in a world of hurt.

I know one other thing: I will never be that person.


71 posted on 12/11/2006 10:37:17 AM PST by Publius Valerius
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To: RockinRight
It depends on your overall situation. Number of properties, retirement plan, and other goals. I certainly don't support if over and over on your 1 house.

You have to take care of your financial plan overall, not just deal with your home in a vacuum.

72 posted on 12/11/2006 10:38:58 AM PST by carolinalivin
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To: Always Right

Read the whole article. The guy's an idiot who had a $129,000 home, a six-figure job and blew through all of his money on self-indulgence. Now, he's in his fifties and (waaahh!) he has no equity and can't make his payments. LOOOOOOSERRRR!


73 posted on 12/11/2006 10:41:03 AM PST by go-dubya-04
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To: carolinalivin

Of course.

I've found in my line of work that people in California are actually LIVING ON the cash they refi out, because on their own incomes they can't come close to affording their mortgage payment...they cash out 100 grand, live on it a couple years, then when the house appreciates another 100 grand...do it again. They actually use it for bills and such.

Also has a major part in explaining why/how people in high-cost areas tend to have MORE in savings than people in low cost areas, when one would expect the opposite.


74 posted on 12/11/2006 10:41:46 AM PST by RockinRight (Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. He's a Socialist. And unqualified.)
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To: Hydroshock

He did commit fraud. He lied about income and stated he would live in at elast one of the homes.


75 posted on 12/11/2006 10:42:18 AM PST by finnman69 (cum puella incedit minore medio corpore sub quo manifestu s globus, inflammare animos)
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To: Publius Valerius
You misstated my job. I'm a financial planner first and I want people for life. You cn't do that if you do a hit and run real estate transaction.

Let me know the date the market will permanently flatten. I will make several adjustments.

My parents bought a home in 1963 for $13,000. It doubled 5 times and sold last year for 450,000

When we have a depression, the population drops, and people stop wanting to live by the ocean, I'll change my approach.

76 posted on 12/11/2006 10:42:39 AM PST by carolinalivin
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To: umgud
"My oldest daughter & hubby bought a home 5 years ago for $160K and have managed to mortgage it the hilt and now owe $475K and its street value is about $400K.

I'm a little slow, cuz I ain't quite figered how they're gonna dig themselves out of that hole."

My mom hears about people that do that all the time. They aren't going to pay it off. And they're stupid. You must be smacking yourself upside the head repeating "where did I go wrong?" My parents most certainly taught me to NEVER borrow against my house or to take out a second mortgage or to do anything but pay it off ASAP! And if you want something save for it and then buy it when you can afford it. I've never bought a new car or had a car payment in my life. We have family friends that have done things like this and well, they aren't doing so good. Declared bankruptcy, no credit, in debit so far that they'll die with it for their children to pay off. You have to feel sorry for their children. The worst was the woman who took 3 mortgages out on her house that she bought for $90K. She owes over $400K on it. And her son, who was the one that came into my mom's office, had NO idea she was doing this. There's nothing she'll ever do short of winning the lottery to fix that hole. Of course, you can only suspect that if she did win the lottery, paying off her debt wouldn't be the first thing on her mind. LOL!
77 posted on 12/11/2006 10:43:24 AM PST by panuke
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To: RockinRight
from

http://thehousingbubbleblog.com/?p=1983

A classic modern Californian, live on debt to prove to everyone how well they are doing. It baffles me to see these people somehow get simpathetic press which only seems to fuel their sense of being a victim. Where was this guys intelligence when he continued to pull money out of his house to buy stocks and cars?
78 posted on 12/11/2006 10:44:23 AM PST by finnman69 (cum puella incedit minore medio corpore sub quo manifestu s globus, inflammare animos)
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To: RockinRight
Friends of ours played that game in Orange County. They refied 7 years in a row. Took great vacations, always had a couple of great cars. They retired last year, sold, and are in a 215,000 4 bdr house in Georgia. They're happy and it looks like they had the last laugh. They each have peace oficer retirement from the state of California.

It's their money. All we can do is provide information and step aside.

79 posted on 12/11/2006 10:45:02 AM PST by carolinalivin
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To: carolinalivin

It very well can work out for people.

However, real estate cannot forever appreciate at 4 times the rate of income going up. As it is, a normal young couple with 2 kids cannot afford to buy a home in CA, DC, most of New England, or most of Florida.


80 posted on 12/11/2006 10:47:11 AM PST by RockinRight (Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. He's a Socialist. And unqualified.)
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