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To: Elyse
The other day I was chastised for not being "pragmatic" like Rudy's supporters and that was like a WHAT? moment where I really felt I had somehow stumbled into some twilight zone hole in the universe and dumped into a DU thread without my knowing it.

Indeed.

It seems that for some the only "pragmatic" solution is surrender of all core values so you can win. It doesn't matter if Rudy is not conservative, and is in fact in agreement with Hillary on most of her views, it only matters that he can "win".


4,503 posted on 04/23/2007 4:25:39 AM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: redgolum
. It doesn't matter if Rudy is not conservative, and is in fact in agreement with Hillary on most of her views, it only matters that he can "win"

I've been here nine years next month, and I'd like to stay around.

BUT

Is it your view that if HRC had become mayor of New York on January 1, 1993 that she would have accomplished the same results as RG by September 10, 2001? (What he did after that date is a one-off).

If she would not have, explain why, since they are "in agreement on most...views".

Does HRC believe individuals are criminally responsible for what they do, not victims of society? Does HRC believe blasphemous "art" should be denied public funding, and its creators shamed? Does HRC believe welfare recipients should be forced to work? Does HRC believe freedom from criminal predation is the most important "civil rights" responsibility of the state? Does HRC believe that individuals are not entitled to government benefits because of their race? Would HRC have confined Yasser Arafat to his hotel when visiting the UN, or would she have given him the freedom of the city?

4,523 posted on 04/23/2007 5:34:30 AM PDT by Jim Noble (We don't need to know what Cho thought. We need to know what Librescu thought.)
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To: redgolum; Elyse

I think that’s what annoys me about the rudy supporters. I love debating with them over the actual record and beliefs of their candidate and my candidate and other candidates. I don’t care how “crass” their charges are, if they are about facts, I can handle it.

But this is a conservative site, and to come here and tell us conservatism is dead and we need to move on, that nobody will vote pro-life so we need to vote pro-abortion, that rudy is inevitable so we shouldn’t talk about his flaws because it will hurt him in the general election, or my favorite “that we are violating Reagan’s 11th commandment”, well that rubbed me the wrong way.

That’s why I started calling them defeatists. They have decided that conservatism has lost the war, and are suing for terms of surrender now. That makes them as “treasonous” to the cause of conservatism as Harry Reid is for his comments that we LOST the war in Iraq while we are still fighting it.

They day may come when the hearts of conservatives shall fail, but it is not this day.


4,582 posted on 04/23/2007 7:14:50 AM PDT by CharlesWayneCT
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