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To: Coyoteman
==There is no obvious cause and effect relationship. What you are really saying is that you don’t know of a scientific explanation for either our intelligence or perceived design in nature, so you are reaching way out and pulling down a supernatural explanation.

Our intelligence proves there is intelligence in the universe. We also design things. Therefore, there is design in the universe. That’s my starting point. Since the dawn of recorded history, we have only observed intelligence coming from intelligence, and design coming from designers. And then there is the will. There is nothing in the chemistry of my body that suggests I should be able to type this message at will. I think it and my fingers start typing the way I want them too and when I want them too. It certainly does not originate from the chemicals that constitute my body. Please explain where this impulse comes from. It’s clearly an epiphenomenon that requires a different kind of explanation than the straitjackets of scientific naturalism can provide. And let’s suppose our consciousness and will are indeed an epiphenomenon, do you think the scientific method should be amended to be able to investigate it? Or would you prefer that such a phenomena forever remain a mystery?

==The entire focus of the ID movement is pushing a Christian Deity.

Complete BS. The ID movement consists of agnostics, deists, and theists of all stripes. Creationists can utilize the findings of ID, but ID cannot utilize creationism because it is not a theological enterprise. In the same way, Creationists can utilize the finding of evolutionists, but evolutionists cannot utilize Creationism. In each case, they are two separate projects.

142 posted on 05/13/2007 10:19:41 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

Creationism is a theological doctrine. but it is part of the philosophical enterprise. Greek philosphy arose from a criticism of the theogony of the old Greeks, and one development of this was Plato’s natural theology. Christian theology is a blending, so to speak, of later Platonism with the Jewish religioius tradition, as one can see in the Wisdom literature of later Judaism. The Christian apologists of the 2nd century were often Platonists at least in theor departure point, which distinguised them from the mythological thinking of the gnostics in important ways. Modern science also owes a great deal to neo-platonism, as we—or at least I -see in Descartes’ efforts to ground science in the mathematical method. So Christian theology and science have at least that in common that they originated in the merger of Athens and Jerusalem.


151 posted on 05/14/2007 8:05:43 AM PDT by RobbyS ( CHIRHO)
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