Skip to comments.At Magnet School, An Asian Plurality
Posted on 07/07/2008 6:33:25 AM PDT by liberallarry
Asian American students will outnumber white classmates for the first time in the freshman class at the region's most prestigious public magnet school this fall, a milestone reached as the number of African Americans and Hispanics has remained low and the Fairfax County School Board prepares to review the school's admission policy.
The rising concentration of Asian Americans at T.J. mirrors demographic trends in other elite math and science magnet schools. In New York, the selective and specialized Stuyvesant High School, Bronx High School of Science and Brooklyn Technical High School have Asian American majorities, although about 10 percent of the metropolitan population is of Asian descent. In San Francisco, Asian Americans make up more than 60 percent of the students at selective Lowell High School and about a third of the city's population.
The demographic imbalance in top public magnet schools has become a sensitive issue, however. Black and Hispanic students often are vastly under-represented. Many of the schools struggle to reflect the diversity of the wider population while maintaining a transparent admissions process with uniformly high standards.
Jenny Tsai, a recent Harvard University graduate, wrote her thesis about what she perceived as a growing sentiment that "too many Asians" were at top magnet schools. She attended the selective Hunter College High School in New York, where she sensed "a certain level of anxiety" as the portion of Asian American students in the entering class grew from less than a third to more than half between 1997 and 2003. Tsai said some students felt a need to justify their admission or their contributions.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
Obama ain’t gonna like this...
See also: “An affirmative action policy that allowed racial and ethnic variations in academic benchmarks was abandoned in the late 1990s. Afterward, admissions of black and Hispanic students plummeted. In 2001, nine black or Hispanic students were admitted, down from nearly 50 in 1994, according to the board’s Minority Student Achievement Oversight Committee.” It is really just a matter of time until all this overachievement is drowned again in a sea of affirmative action.
Maybe they qualified and others didn’t. It’s just a thought.
This list is for intellectual discussion of articles and issues related to public education (including charter schools) from the preschool to university level. Items more appropriately placed on the Naughty Teacher list, Another reason to Homeschool list, or of a general public-school-bashing nature will not be pinged.
If you would like to be on or off this list, please freepmail Amelia, Gabz, Shag377, or SoftballMominVa
Silly you! Obama's gonna send you to re-education camp.
Who’s that! And what kind of education does she provide?
She is a realdoll for sure.
I know all those arguments. I’m just not convinced.
Looks to me like her specialty is heartache.
Maybe they should be ‘bussed’ to all the other schools to even things out?
(hey, they thought it would work for other minority groups)
I agree with amd -
it’s not genetics, it’s not skin color or the shape of the eye,
it’s the culture and the culture’s values that are at work here,
both at the positive and negative end of the academic achievement scale.
Just like the old days when it was thought that a black child would instantly perform better because he was sitting next to a white child.
I work with a slew of Asian Scientists. Most are quite intelligent, some not so much. All of them got where they are through hard work.
Recent research has shown that very small differences in DNA ARE very important. How much DNA do we have in common with chimps? Something like 99 or 99.5 percent.
Oh yeah. No denying the value of hard work and culture. Just no denying the value of genes either.
IT is not genetics, it is attitude. Blacks from Africa, genetically identical to American blacks, come over to the USA and are very successful - because they are hardworking and positive about the future.
Have any statistics to support that? Because it contradicts everything I’ve read about Africans immigrants to America, or anywhere.
Might just be me but that girl seems awfully young - too young to have pics posted of her on a website.
“The success of Asian American students reflects the educational commitment found in many immigrant communities, particularly for second-generation students fluent in English and encouraged by upwardly mobile parents who came to the United States for higher education or professional positions.”
“Minority advocates and education experts say raising black and Hispanic enrollment at T.J. must be a long-term effort.”
Hey! Advocates! It starts at home, you fools!
Sadly there are far too many schools in the USA who have Asian quotas. For the obvious reasons. Other parents strongly object to their own children being outshown by the Asian students.
I give up. Stop.
I'll tell her.
Even if DNA can account for 5-10 points of IQ, which I’d have to see controlled studies to convince me,
such a deficit (or advantage) can be easily overcome by the values of the parents, both in a positive or negative way.
How does this story and so many other like it benefit my Italian/Czech American kids?
It’s just another indicator that my kid’s inheritance is being handed over to someone else’s kids.
That said, there are many examples of high performing minority children who have motivated parents AND a highly motivated staff of administrators and teachers who are dedicated to seeing that the students get an education.
I thought this would be a serious thread but with a handle like yours, and the pics ASA Vet insists on posting, its turning into a clown show.
Not just your kid’s inheritance, but possibly even your OTHER children’s very existance.
How many couples out there, due to the tax burden of paying for the illegitimate bastards of welfare recipients, are choosing not to have any more kids?
Plus Obama didn’t need a bump in his LSAT to get into Harvard, oh wait a minute, he won’t disclose that...
I don't think modern societies have reached the sophistication necessary for the individual characteristics of each race to start displaying their relative (genetic) advantages to the extent that it matters, as much as cultural inclination does.
Asia, by itself, is extremely diverse, genetically.
If the study includes Southern and Western Asia, then even more so.
Asian: A person having origins in any of the original peoples of the Far East, Southeast Asia, or the Indian subcontinent including, for example, Cambodia, China, India, Japan, Korea, Malaysia, Pakistan, the Philippine Islands, Thailand, and Vietnam. It includes "Asian Indian," "Chinese," "Filipino," "Korean," "Japanese," "Vietnamese," and "Other Asian."
Source: US Census Bureau http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/meta/long_68178.htm
Robert C. Bowman, M.D.
Asian ethnicity students are the fastest growing body of US allopathic medical students. Asian Indian students are the fastest growing group within US Asian medical students. About 1 in 17 Asian Indians of medical student age (age 18-24 census data) is an allopathic medical student. The characteristics of Asian medical students can help understand medical school admissions probabilities.
America is growing ever more diverse at an increasing rate. The United States is attracting some of the wealthiest and most educated from across the planet. The United States is also attracting some of the least educated and poorest from its nearest neighbors. What is actually most amazing is that the populations with the highest rates of growth from both immigration and fertility are those at either end of the socioeconomic spectrum. Fertility rates are highest in Asian Indian (74.5 per 1000) and South American groups (58 60 per 1000) with the same or greater status compared to whites contrasted with those with broader distributions of income such as Vietnamese (71.8 per 1000), Mexican (82.8 per 1000) and Guatamalan (92.1 per 1000) White and most other populations have rates of 45 - 55 per 1000. The immigration problems of the United States involve poor economics in a few nearby nations. Strengthening education and economics in Mexico and Central America would seem to make more sense than currently proposed policies, especially those costing billions without addressing the differentials in economics. Taking dentists, doctors, and educated people from Mexico and Central America would seem to make the least sense of all. What makes the most sense is addressing our own weaknesses in child development and early education and in distribution of resources, and working to meet our own needs as well as those of neighbors and all who plan to retain civilized society. see The American Community - Asians: 2004 The American Community - Hispanics: 2004
The United States appears to be headed a different direction. Populations disadvantaged for decades or centuries remain limited and new populations are being added into the type of poverty that has the least reason to exist: child poverty.
The lack of data compiled by social class often means that the data is presented by race or ethnicity, when the actual changes involve changes in status, not race or ethnicity. Colleges and medical schools rarely want the public to know how exclusive that they have become, how status is related to standardized test scores, how testing is important to the finances of the associations, or other sensitive areas.
Admissions is related to higher income, greater family education (college and professional), urban origins, and proximity to medical schools. MCAT scores are also related to the same factors. Physician distribution and choice of family medicine and rural practice has an inverse relationship with the above. In Asian students there was significant decline in USMLE 1 compared to MCAT while whites had increased USMLE 1 compared to MCAT. (Veloski reference) This may be a likely pattern not just for Asian students, but for all with the characteristics of Asian students, particularly highest income, urban origin, and children of professional parents. Medical schools are admitting more and more medical students with dual professional parents, regardless of race or ethnicity.
Asian Indian medical student had 2.2% choice of family medicine, the lowest in the nation for any group. This is now likely to be closer to 1% now. Vietnamese, at the opposite in income and education, have 15 - 20% choice of family medicine. First generation to college is a particularly powerful indicator for family medicine and most other service-oriented careers (nurses, teachers, public servants, counselors). Broad distributions of income are better sources of family physicians. Distribution by Income Levels
Rural location choice is greatest for those born in rural areas, Native American, then white, then Black and Hispanic, and then Asian. Again this has to do with the rural vs urban origins of each ethnicity ranging from 40 - 50% for Natives to 30% for whites to 10% for Black and Hispanic to 3% for Asian medical students. Asian family physicians have only 6% rural choice, but also are born, raised, and trained in states such as California and 25% are found in California (next is Texas with 9%). 6% rural location in a state with 3 - 4 % rural population is twice the level. As with other ethnic groups, choice of family medicine increases rural choice by 50 - 150%.
To understand the range of impacts involved, it is useful to understand some basic information. Even among Asian groups there are divisions which really have more to do with income levels and access to education than any stereotype. Perhaps there have been no more dramatic differences than during WWII.
During my search to match each US physician to a birth city and state, I found 7 born in Rivers, AZ. Others were born in Amache and Heart Mountain. I had difficulty identifying a town that no longer exists. Finally I was able to piece together what I think is the origins of these physicians. Here is a picture of that town Over 1000 from this town served in the US military and 23 died in WWII in service to the US. This was no small internment camp since the high school graduated 97 in 1944. Most had origins in the Los Angeles area prior to the war. It appears that they returned home after the war, at least regarding the physicians, since nearly all graduated from California medical schools. The Japanese American community finally received an official apology from President Reagan and 22 from WWII finally received Congressional Medal of Honor Awards from President Clinton. This was too late for many who left the United States in the years following WWII.
Understanding why Asians are so concentrated in certain parts of the nation means understanding influences over the decades. Many returned to "Chinatowns" because of problems with discrimination. They developed an interdependent society in such locations. New immigrants and family members came to the same locations. These locations were the largest cities and had close proximity to medical schools and colleges. (Zhou Min and Rebecca Y. Kim) Other groups have established tight social structures such as Jewish peoples and Mormons. They have had similar concentration and success.
To understand the magnitude of the differences in medical education, I suggest a Download of Facts and Figures XII in Portable Document Format (PDF). (174 pages - 997.8 KB) from the Association of American Medical Colleges and also the 2005 report
Kenneth Ludmerer in Time to Heal and others have noted some not so stellar past history in medical education. Some, if not many medical schools, at various times in US history have practiced "quotas." For example there were only a handful of medical schools that actively fought quotas of Jewish physicians 60 or more years ago. There have also been discrimination patterns in the past against Asian ethnicity students. Lower income Asians and others performing at a high level may still have great difficulty in admissions, particularly in states with fewer medical school positions. The differences between admission or not for whites and Asians is very small in GPA and MCAT. see Minorities in Medicine Applicants Accepted and Rejected
Using the 2001 version of AAMC Minorities in Medicine, the following table is created from the AAMC data using 18 - 24 year olds (7 years of age group) and 1994 - 2000 graduates (7 years of allopathic graduates) and some of my birth origin data. For more on choice of FP, ethnicity, income, and admissions see Medicine, Education, and Social Status
Admissions Ratios and US Medical Students Allopathic US Medical Student Admissions by ethnicity, income, rural vs urban Asian students are admitted in the highest ratios and have the highest income levels in many areas. Note that the lowest income origin groups, blacks and rurals, have the lowest admission ratios and the lowest income origins. These two also share a common trait of fewer progressing in just about any form of higher education and greater impacts on males.
About 96% of US Asians live in 1993 urban influence codes 1 and 2 or the metropolitan counties of the nation.
US Asians live in the areas that are considered "most desirable," at least for those who desire concentrations. Given past coastal, urban, and Pacific Ocean proximity for many, this is not surprising.
US Asians are about half born in the US and half born in other countries. Of those born in other countries, 45% live in 3 cities, Los Angeles, New York, and San Francisco. http://www.census.gov/prod/2002pubs/cenbr01-3.pdf
This graphic is very similar to one I prepared on Asian parent income distribution from AAMC data.
In the following table, those born in various urban influence codes, those born in other countries (Asian group), and those born in Puerto Rico, Guam, Virgin Islands, Marianas, etc. are shown Admissions Ratio By Birth Origin
|n =||% of US allo||Choice of FP for Residency Grads 97-03||Compare to Gold Standard|
|Born in counties of over 1 million and US allopathic private medical schools||20625||18.7%||9.1%||-64.5%|
|Born over 1 million and public||30892||28.0%||16.1%||-37.5%|
|Born urban < 1 million and Private||6623||6.0%||11.9%||-53.6%|
|Born urban < 1 million and Public||19033||17.2%||19.6%||-23.9%|
|NonMetro birth and Allo Private||2023||1.8%||15.7%||-39.1%|
|NonMetro birth and Allo Public||8484||7.7%||25.7%||0.0%|
|Born PR, GU, VI, CZ, MH, AS Private||1062||1.0%||8.9%||-65.3%|
|Born PR, GU, VI, CZ, MH, AS Public||960||0.9%||9.8%||-62.0%|
|Core Urban US Born/Raised (Born or raised in counties of over 1 million)||72207||65.4%|
|Metro US Born/Raised||97863||88.7%|
The lowest choice of FP yet identified is Indian-Pakistani origin US allopathic medical students at 2.2% choice of FP. This is the fastest rising group of Asian medical students and Asian students are the fastest rising group admitted to US allopathic schools. Parent Income and Ethnicity and FP Choice Indian medical students are likely to have the highest income levels and their parents have the most education and professional degrees, followed closely by the Chinese. In contrast is the Vietnamese segment, with the lowest parent income level and the highest choice of family medicine although Vietnamese are changing rapidly.
Don’t worry, I’m doing my part for Wester Civilization.
My family who fought in America’s Great Wars would be proud of us. But I don’t think they’d be happy to see what’s happening in America right now.
My oldest daughter’s class spent an entire week on MLK whereas her class only spent 1 day - just one day on George Washington, Thomas Jefferson and Adam — all three of them in one day.
All of this “diversity is strength” nonsense doesn’t benefit my Italian/Czech American kids in any way.
Read Thomas Sowell’s book “The Economics and Politics of Race” for starters. Perhaps I should qualify that I am talking about the non-Muslim African immigrants, i.e. Christian of one persuasion or another.
I’m homeschooling, and going to have more than the “replacement rate” of children.
That’s how I’m doing my part.
I’m fortunate in that God has provided our family the means to do so.
Genes of course play a very significant role and any one who says otherwise doesn’t live in reality and has swallowed a load of PC nonsense. Over thirty individuals have run 100 meters under 10 seconds and all of them are of West African descent. Is that because everyone else doesn’t have the proper culture or hard work ethic?
The brain is the last frontier; it's inconceivable that it won't be be fully understood within 50-100 years. What a grand irony it will be if (A) scientists develop gene therapies that allow (AAs) to excel in various academic disciplines.
I really like Sowell. His “Ethnic America” answered a lot of questions for me. But I think he’s wrong about genes. Even though his critique of “The Bell Curve” was very good.
Good for you! I have 4 and it’s really not that big of a deal. Movies and TV shows always try to make it seem as if it’s a mad house but it’s not. A house with only 2 kids seems so empty to me.
Hard not to do well when you are afforded MBE status, ‘consideration’ in acceptance to the best schools and other perks.
Wait ... you’ve got to remember ... “white” has been DECONSTRUCTED.
In other words, you have a bunch of whites kids drifting through the schools with parents who feel ashamed of their identity and don’t really know who they are. Why? Because Hollywood, academia and diversity seminars in corporate America have DECONSTRUCTED people from the European tribe.
They’re taught to feel guilt, they’re taught to have misplaced compassion, to not do their best so the other kids can get ahead, etc.
I know exactly what I’m talking about. I have a B.S. in Psychology, still study Psych and I’m involved with the advertising industry.
If you don’t know who you are or feel guilty about who you are YOU WILL NOT PERFORM WELL.
It’s like psyching a boxer out - if he’s psyched out he’s not going to perform well.
Especially when people forget that Asia itself is racially diverse.
>>>>>Might just be me but that girl seems awfully young - too young to have pics posted of her on a website.<<<<<
Nope, ASA Vet is posting pics of his wife again.
ASA, you are one fortunate man.
Look at present day America today.
White kids are taught their ancestors were drooling, evil, ignorant savages. How can you perform with that nonsense being drilled into your head?
Here in 2008 America, look at all of the negative Italian sterotypes. And if your kids have any Eastern European blood in them, there’s bad sterotypes about them too. Lots of these video games for example involve shooting at Germans and Eastern Europeans. They involve Italian thugs killing people.
I suspect culture has more to do with it.