We helped in Iraq - now help us, beg Georgians

Times Online (U.K.) ^ | August 10, 2008 | by Tony Halpin

[Nik Naym]

“As a Russian jet bombed fields around his village, Djimali Avago, a Georgian farmer, asked me: “Why won’t America and Nato help us? If they won’t help us now, why did we help them in Iraq?””

Know what?

He is right. We owe them. I am ashamed of how we are (are not) handling this.

[DoughtyOne]

I’m not sure why I am prone to refer to that as South Odessa, when it’s South Ossetia, but I seem to be.

[abishai]

Only this time there are no Roosevelts or Churchills.

[DoughtyOne]

Agreed.

[Lijahsbubbe]

Why did they have to wait so long to be admitted to NATO? Russia has been up to no good concerning this area for quite awhile.

Some interesting info:

For years Russia has been issuing passports to Abkhaz and South Ossetia residents.

In March, Moscow announced that it was opting out of a CIS (Commonwealth of Independent States) a ban on trade and travel with Abkhazia. Russia has also said it was considering establishing some form of diplomatic representation in the two regions.

Moreover, Russia has thousands of troops in the two provinces, ostensibly serving as peacekeepers. For years, Russia has been issuing passports to Abkhaz and South Ossetia residents.

Not much in between Georgia and Iran. Looks like Azerbaijan is next in line.

[Lijahsbubbe]

Russia has been planning this for quite awhile.

I know. I said that in my post. :O

[hermgem]

Solution:
Send Obama over there, he will bring all those different factions together in never ending peace.
Better do it now before Obama strips U.S. forces and serves as peacemaker of the world based on his world view and talking skills without preconditions.

[goldstategop]

America is not prepared to risk war with Russia over a small country. The best we can do is offer our moral support.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[05 Mustang GT Rocks]

Are you talking about the same Roosevelt that gave the whole Eastern Europe to Stalin?

[Virginia Ridgerunner]

Well, the Georgians do have a point. Alliances are double-edged swords, and they put themselves on the line for us in Iraq, while Russia was helping the Syrians and Iranians develop nukes.

[MinorityRepublican]

How much does Georgia deserves the blame for provoking the Russian Bear out of its slumber?

[Billthedrill]

There's actually a fair amount we can do, but marching an army in isn't one of the options. Direct military options are no more practical for us than they would be for the Russians in, say, Cuba.

This could easily turn into another Chechnya, which, by the way, is a neighbor to Georgia's north. And Chechnya could turn sour again. What Putin is risking here in an attempt to intimidate ex-satellites is that they might turn too hot to hold. That's always the problem when you foment a revolution as the Russians did in South Ossetia - one never really knows how it is going to turn out. In this particular case it served as a pretext for Russian aggression against Georgia. Should this continue into an occupation of Georgia in toto and the setting up of a puppet government, I do believe a guerilla war will be inevitable. Should it settle out into international guarantees for South Ossetia's independence and peacekeepers other than Russian to enforce it as I believe will be the trend within the UN, then the struggle is likely to be more protracted but not differ much in character. Either way Putin gains: a de facto puppet state with physical control of the pipeline, or an ever-present threat of the same and "peacekeepers" other than Russian getting shot at to maintain it.

Unfortunately much in the situation depends on actors other than the United States to oppose the Russians, notably a toothless EU so besotted with "soft power" that it is willing to call any outcome a victory, and a Turkey little disposed to aiding an EU that has spurned its membership. Turkey will also be little disposed to a re-establishment of the Cold War status quo with a Russian military presence on its border. And Iran, at the eastern end of this geostrategic mess, will be happy to see a U.S. ally humiliated and the strengthening of its Russian ties enhanced, including support for its nuclear programs and military sales such as anti-air missiles to protect them. This is widely touted as a Russian answer to Kosovo, but I think it's a bit bigger than that; in a sense it is a Russian answer to Iraq. And a Russian-Iranian alliance would be an enormous bid for regional power in the northern Middle East.

Those then are the players and what I think might be the stakes. We need to play this one carefully. IMHO.

[Nuc1]

Arm them. Tank killers, plane killers, and ship killers. Give them missiles, planes and armor. The Georgians will take care of the rest.

[brytlea]

Are there no economic sanctions we can bring to bear?
susie

[brytlea]

What do you guys do when you see the bully beating up the kid down the street?
Do you say, well he obviously didn’t act wiseley and walk past?

Apparently many do exactly that.

susie

[Philly Nomad]

Considering the trouble Reagan had in Lebanon, and the current troubles in Iraq and Afghanistan, you might want to rethink the real-world ability of today’s US Military. And Reagan’s stomach for a even fight.

They are going to do to us in Georgia, what we did to them in Kosovo. And if the US fails, that will cripple our Foregin Policy for the next 20 years. Georiga is one of the strongest US Allies, voting with the US, sending troops to Iraq, joining NATO. And what happens if the US let’s Russia get away with it? It’s going to be a lot more difficult to ask smaller countries to sacrifice for US goals. We might have to give Putin a big prize in order to help Georgia - Missle Defense, Kosovo or NATO.

[Flavius]

not really sure what they missed about no hope lots of change
And stellar negotiations

Actually they better hope they get some smooth talker to beg the Russians not to totally level the place

[brytlea]

You must have West Texas on your mind! ;)
susie

[1rudeboy]

um, what would Pat [Buchanan] say?

Pat will be on Morning Joe tomorrow blaming this all on the neocons.

[Norman Bates]

Give them intelligence, satellite photos, fly AWACs and J-STARS from standoff range.