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To: jimmyray
So the choices are, believe that the universe is 6000 years old or be an atheist? Most of the Church Fathers did not spend much time speculating about obscure Bible verses, trying to enforce a wooden literalism about minor details that are not important anyway. Someone did estimate that the earth might have been created in 4000 B.C., but that was not at the center of anyone's theology. The Apostles, Church Fathers and others did spend a lot of time talking and writing about Law, Grace, Jesus and tried to keep these things central. Many people from the early Church Fathers to Martin Luther and beyond warned against taking obscure verses and making a big deal out of obscure and unimportant things.

Fundamentalism stands this principle on its head while it majors in minor things and pushes minor things to the point of legalism. So you have people teaching that you have to believe the world is 6000 years old if you are to be saved, or they have Christians anxiously reading the newspaper looking for the Anti-Christ (not reading the Bible looking for Christ), worried that if they misread the signs of the times they will be "left behind."

95 posted on 08/26/2008 5:29:01 AM PDT by Wilhelm Tell (True or False? This is not a tag line.)
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To: Wilhelm Tell
As one tries to reconcile the irreconcilable differences between the two theories, consider theses quote by Julina Huxley:

The supernatural is being swept out of the universe in the flood of new knowledge of what is natural. It will soon be as impossible for an intelligent, educated man or woman to believe in a god as it is now to believe the earth is flat, that flies can be spontaneously generated... or that death is always due to witchcraft... The god hypothesis is no longer of any pragmatic value for the interpretation or comprehension of nature, and indeed often stands in the way of better and truer interpretation. Operationally, God is beginning to resemble not a ruler but the last fading smile of a cosmic Cheshire cat. Religion without Revelation (1957) p. 58

In the evolutionary pattern of thought, there is neither need nor room for the supernatural. The earth was not created; it evolved. So did all the animals and plants that inhabit it, including our human selves, mind and soul as well as brain and body. So did religion. The Humanist Frame (1961) p. 18

The teaching of a 6 day creation, and a young earth, is hardly new, nor is it based on obscure passages. Genesis 1:1 contains the explanation of the orign of everything - time, space, matter, and the rest of the chapter explains waht He did in 6 literal, 24 hour days. This is repeated in Exodus 20:11, For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.. It is doubtful that Moses thought this was anything more than six 24 hour periods. Jesus, in Matthew 19:4, affirmed that God MADE Adam and Eve, they did not evolve over some period of time, "Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,'. The concept of original sin is explored in Romans, Acts, and I Corinthians.

So yes, it is one or the other, Creation or Evolution, for they are independent of each other, and are diametrically opposed. The middle ground compromise polutes and subverts both viewpoint, and is anathema to the educated Evolutionist, as well as the educated Christian. If you can compromise the scripture and Christianity on origins, then every theological position is open for compromise. Why would one believe in a god that required the constant life & death struggle for millions of years to produce man, who was barely different from his "ancestor"? Comproimised Christianity, and the result of that theology, is why Churches lose an overwhelming percentage of youth. They see the inconsistencies, and realize THEY can determine what in the scripture is true or not, allegory or reality. Thus, "The wages of sin is death" becomes "sin is a bad idea, but it's OK with God; don't sweat the obscure stuff."

The crux of the matter, though, is that: 1. we have brokend God's laws, and stnad under condemnation 2. Jesus came to be a sacrifice to pay for our sin 3. He rose from the dead to prove his claims true. 4. Each one must decide what to do with this Jesus, and the consequences of that decision are dramatic.

122 posted on 08/26/2008 8:01:47 AM PDT by jimmyray
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