Posted on 11/24/2008 12:56:31 AM PST by 2ndDivisionVet
The point is that the questions of “why” physical constants happen to be compatible with intelligence or “how” they got that way are meaningless, since they obviously cannot be asked unless the constants do in fact permit intelligence to arise. As I noted earlier, this is a form of the Texas Sharpshooter joke.
Our Creator is first discovered through observing natural cause and effect. The more Atheists run away from God, the more they will find Him.
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Sure it is. If there is no deity, everything is allowed. And if everything is allowed, there are funner things to aspire to than "love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control."
There's always fame, fortune, amusement, excitement, comfort, pleasure and ease.
Perhaps it will be objected that these things can bring fulfillment only in the short run. On the other hand, without faith, a short run is all you've got. Why waste it on patience and faithfulness?
There's some history here:
Acts 24:25
As Paul talked about righteousness, self-control and the judgment to come, Felix was afraid and said, "That's enough for now! You may leave. When I find it convenient, I will send for you."
These atheistic scientists should decouple God from religion. The ‘Religion = God’ formula seems to be confusing them.
Religions are man made. They are constructs, responses to internal and external forces which couldn’t be comprehended, and have been used to all manner of control and convenience for thousands of years. The ‘God’ you find in the various religions is inevitably unscientific.
But God isn’t religion. God is in the smallest and largest things, and in everything. If we look, inside and out, big and small, in how things work and how things balance and how things are, God will be come apparent.
One thing you’ll notice about those who claim
“morality doesn’t require God” -
they always define “moral behavior” in accordance with
their own actual behavior choices.
So, by self-definition, they are “moral” people.
This is Pantheism, and I reject it as unbiblical. It is the worship of the creation instead of the creator.
If you'd say the EVIDENCE of God, or the EVIDENCE of divine creation "is in everything", you'd be biblically correct.
I like the Old Testament better, at least when it comes to concept of hell, which is absent.
In the OT, once you expired, whether it was through god's numerous genocides, plagues, or triggered natural disasters, he was done with you; there was no punishment for the dead.
If such a place actually existed, mankind should rightfully lobby for its abolition.
The only difference between atheists and believers wanting others to believe as they do is that believers really do believe that there is a hereafter and that everyone will spend it somewhere. There’s the concern for where.
As far as others making up their own minds, as believer, I do feel that choice is theirs. I’m not nervous about others not believing as I do because I perceive it as a threat to my own beliefs; I’m secure enough in them that other’s faith, or lack of it, doesn’t faze me.
Likewise, I don’t want anyone making false professions just for lip service.
And I'll ask you the same question:
Where in your experience have you seen something come from nothing (or in the case of the universe - everything coming from nothing)?
“morality doesn’t require God” -
they always define “moral behavior” in accordance with
their own actual behavior choices.
So, by self-definition, they are “moral” people.
True for believers as well.
A "personal" god is a running fad with the religious community. It seems that everyone seems to know god and exactly what he wants, which obviously differs from person to person.
You're just as likely to have a Christian disagree with another Christian on what is "moral" as you would a Christian and a non-believer.
bump
So it goes.....
In other words, the Texas Sharpshooter who shoots a hundred bullets at a wall and then paints a hundred bulls-eyes around them is ten times more impressive than one who does only ten of each. Gotcha.
Likewise, the “morality doesn’t require God” crowd usually defines morals the same as those established BY God.
Even they see the wisdom of “Love thy neighbor as thyself” and “Do unto others....”.
They just come up with all kinds of convoluted reasons why they can justify agreeing with Scripture without just coming out and admitting that it’s right because....
Gunrunner: "True for believers as well."
I don't think so. I know lots and lots of Christians who quickly admit to moral failure. It's rare to find agnostics or atheists who admit they fall far short of their own moral standards. As for "disagreements"....even the self-proclaimed christians who favor allowing abortion are very quick to tell you they are "personally opposed" to it.
You need to read the OT better if that's what you think.
This “universal morality” is what many (including CS Lewis) refer to as a “personal revelation” of God.
Romans 2:15
They show that what the law requires is written on their hearts. The way their minds judge them gives witness to that fact. Sometimes their thoughts find them guilty. At other times their thoughts find them not guilty.
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