Delusions of Evolution

I'll look into it, but you realize that it was from Augustine that the Catholic church got purgatory from, right?

Purgatory by the way denies the sufficiency of Christ' atonement on the cross. Most Christian theologians consider the idea of purgatory as heresy. So while Augustine was probably one of the top Christian scholars of the 1st 1500 years of Christianity, some of his teaching were way off and helped to lead the Catholic Church down a rocky road.

As Christians we must realize we stand upon the shoulders of giants, but ultimately it is the Scriptures that are the backbone and basis for our doctrine, not men.

Another great scholar of the early years was Origen, and while he carried the church and did more to bring Christianity to the forefront of Scholastic acceptance to the known world at that time, he also thought that Satan could be saved and that Christs death on the cross was not complete and he denied the the material resurrection of Christ.

So while I accept these men as great I also take them as only men. In some ways we actually have a better understanding of the Scriptures then they did because we have better access to more knowledge of the time when Christ lived and the times of the OT writers.

I will accept the pew poll that said 30% of Christians believe in Theistic Evolution. That leaves 70% of Christians who believe the 7 day creation story of Scriptures.

Do you have a link to that poll? I can't find one that polled only Christians, and the only one I can find that breaks out the responses by religious affiliation shows that a majority of Catholics, Orthodox, and "mainline Protestants" agree that "evolution is the best explanation for the origins of human life on earth." (It's here--warning: big PDF.) Since there are more of them than there are of other Christian groups, it would seem that a majority of Christians accept that statement about evolution.

Also, most such polls offer at least a third alternative, usually unguided (non-Theistic) evolution, so you can't assume that everyone who doesn't accept Theistic evolution accepts the 7-day story by default.

Here This poll actually has 62% believe the story of a 7 day creation while only39% believe the myth of evolution. I couldn't find the one I referenced earlier, but this is even better. It is only Christians and does not break them down by affiliation. Christians Ignorant about Evolution According to ChristiaNet Poll I hope this satisfyes you. Because wherever you pulled yopur numbers from is wayyyy Off dude.

You waved away the MSNBC poll and you said you’d accept a Pew poll. So I found a 270-page Pew report on religion in America, with extensive discussion of methodology and complete results, and all of a sudden Pew is “wayyyy Off dude.” But you do like a poll apparently conducted solely of the visitors to a Christian Web site with an anti-evolution slant. (I say “apparently” because they don’t bother to disclose their methodology.)

It seems you will only accept the results of polls that support what you want to believe, whether or not you know how they were conducted. Not a very intellectually rigorous approach.

It seems you will only accept the results of polls that support what you want to believe,

If I was playing games, I would have looked until I found one that made me look better, not worse.

No, the poll I originally mentioned I could not find.

,The one I gave you a link to was actually higher in the number that believed in TToE.

The reason I liked the one I gave you a link to is because it was done by Christians. Personally I do not see them having any agenda other then telling what they see as the truth. That is why their poll is actually worse for my point then the one I originally mentioned.

Personally I do not see them having any agenda other then telling what they see as the truth.

I have no doubt that the respondents told the truth about their beliefs. My point is just that we have no information on how the poll was conducted, other than that apparently it was of ChristiaNet visitors (a website that offers anti-evolution e-cards). You can't extrapolate the results to what all Christians believe.

First you say you have no doubt that the respondents told the truth about their beliefs.

Then you basically say you disagree with the methodology of the poll the Christian site that took the poll because they did not publish the particulars of their poll.

They are not politically motivated and they did not publish this poll to the media like CBS, PEW, or GALLUP to make points, they took it to see where they need to focus their work at. There was no reason for them to publish the particulars. Other pollsters have to because they make their money publishing their polls. This was an internal Christian poll for their own purpose

There is no reason for them to lie, they could care less what you think. It was a story about the need to educate Christians on the fallacy of evolution by pointing out that while most Christians believe in Creationism, they know very little about evolution.

Besides that there is no poll that says a majority of Americans in general believe in evolution, instead poll after poll states that most Americans, regardless of whether they have a religious faith, do not believe in evolution.

Here are some reputable pollsters that make my point about Americans in general and their beliefs. Sorry, YOU Lose!

CBS Poll: Majority Reject Evolution

Gallup: On Darwin’s Birthday, Only 4 in 10 Believe in Evolution

PEW: Darwin Debated: Religion vs. Evolution

I still stand by my statement, you are wrong. now go away, shew fly shew.

There was no reason for them to publish the particulars. Other pollsters have to because they make their money publishing their polls. This was an internal Christian poll for their own purpose

Boy, you really have no idea what you're talking about, do you? And like so many, when caught short of facts, you fall back on rudeness.

First of all, the link you provided went to ChristianNewsWire, "the most effective way to get your press release into the hands of reporters and news producers." What were you saying about ChristiaNet not publishing their polls? If it was really just for their own purpose, they wouldn't have issued a press release.

Second, I didn't accuse them of lying. I am not questioning the results of their poll. What I'm questioning is your conclusion that their poll represents the views of "Christians" in general. To their credit, they don't claim the poll represents all Christians; but you did.

And I never claimed that most Americans believe in evolution. But those polls don't support your claim, which is what is in question here.

I still stand by my statement,

With no facts to back it up, and in the face of polls that contradict it, you still stand by your statement. Great. I will happily "shew" rather than waste more time on someone who doesn't think it's important to be truthful.

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.