Posted on 09/23/2010 5:33:23 AM PDT by marktwain
Madison police said Wednesday they will rescind obstructing citations wrongly issued to two of five men who were openly carrying firearms while eating at a Culver's restaurant, and instead cite all five men for disorderly conduct.
"It seems to me like (police) are just digging a deeper hole," said John R. Monroe, a Georgia attorney who specializes in open carry and firearms cases.
But City Attorney Michael May said, "I think if someone's going to sue the city, it will come from the actions that have already taken place."
Chief Noble Wray admitted police erred in issuing citations for obstructing officers to the two men who refused to identify themselves to officers sent to the restaurant near East Towne Mall on Saturday after a patron called 911 because she was concerned about the armed men and feared something "horrible" could happen.
Wisconsin is one of 43 states that allow some form of open carry of firearms, and Monroe said police cannot demand that someone identify themselves just because they are carrying a gun.
Shawn M. Winrich, 33, of Madison, and Frank R. Hannan-Rock, 53, of Racine, were handcuffed, searched and detained until officers determined they were not felons prohibited from possessing firearms.
But Wray said that after further investigation all five men, who are members of the gun-rights group Wisconsin Carry, would be cited for disorderly conduct because the caller, a 62-year-old woman, along with a second patron interviewed this week told police they were disturbed by the armed men.
Monroe, who is also vice president of GeorgiaCarry.org, said that is not enough to warrant a disorderly conduct charge. "If they were doing nothing more than carrying firearms," he said, "that cannot constitute disorderly conduct in and of itself."
Wray said a disorderly conduct charge takes into account the totality of a situation and what would be considered reasonable.
Police did not release the names of the other three men, who are from Racine, Mauston and Elkhorn, because they have not received their citations.
Wray stressed that he wants people to call 911 if they are concerned about someone with a firearm and said police will continue to investigate each call on a case-by-case basis to determine if disorderly conduct or other charges are warranted.
Auric Gold, secretary of Wisconsin Carry, said he was glad the obstruction charges were being dropped, but he called the disorderly conduct charges "bogus."
John Pierce, founder of OpenCarry.org, called the new charges "nothing more than retaliation."
Wray said it is not unusual for police to review charges and said he felt the disorderly conduct citations were appropriate.
City Attorney May said his office told police it did appear the obstructing charge was appropriate, but left it to police to determine if they had probable cause for other charges.
May said his office would review the disorderly conduct charges after receiving all police reports on the incident and before those cited are scheduled to appear in court.
Being in the presence of flaming lieburrals disturbs me but I don’t think I would call the police about it.
Wonder if I could get the Madison police to arrest Obama, Reid and Pelosi next time they’re in town.
The Madison PD is digging themselves a mighty big hole here. I hope these guys end up owning the Police Station.
Almost a ‘Nevada Costco’ incident.
These five men should be able to sue this dumbass caller.
I am very disturbed!
These guys should be licking their lips in anticipation of a nice payday. I hope they don’t wuss out and let the candy-assed lefty cops doing the bidding of their fascist masters get a walk. It’s time for the cops to learn their lesson, and that lesson is that we the people intend to exercise every right we have under the BoR.
Disturbing the peace, is the right call, leveled at the caller. No one with a lick of sense, could make any other decision.
The City of Racine just paid out $45,000.00 in another recent case of unlawful arrest and citation over the same sort of action. It’s a legal right here, the review will lead to rescinded charges or a payout if the City Attorney is foolish enough to press forward.
Operator: "911, what's your emergency?"
Caller: "There's a man here who's openly carrying a gun and is wearing a police officer's uniform. I'm concerned that something horrible could happen."
Operator: "The SWAT team will be there in five minutes."
Defund city hall. Vote NO to municipal bond issues, sales tax extensions. Many of you will feel “irresponsible” for doing so. At least at first. But starve the Beast as a matter of policy. We all benefit.
You want smaller, cheaper, less powerful government? It starts on mainstreet.
Sue their butts off.
If the state supreme court has already ruled that OC is not disorderly, then if the city atty has half a brain he will quash the charges. Otherwise, I think the 5 have a federal civil rights action avenue for this obvious abuse of power.
The inquest started yesterday, this one is going to be interesting.
Very well said! Bump!
“lefty cops doing the bidding of their fascist masters get a walk.”
This is why I despise the concept of “police.” They obey their leftist masters and are tools for totalitarianism. The proper type of peace officer for a free people is an elected sheriff.
He’s accountable to the people via the ballot box and can ignore illegal demands from other office holders. In fact, he can devote part of his staff to investigating criminals holding public office.
On the other hand, “cops” are unaccountable to the people. They must answer to their Marxist masters. All police departments should be disbanded and its members, after a thorough investigation and vetting, be considered for admission to sheriff departments.
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