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To: Rodentking

But what do we mean when we say He is the Savior of the world? The Redeemer? Each of these titles point to the truth that Jesus Christ is the only way by which we can return to live with our Heavenly Father. Jesus suffered and was crucified for the sins of the world, giving each of God’s children the gift of repentance and forgiveness. Only by His mercy and grace can anyone be saved. His subsequent resurrection prepared the way for every person to overcome physical death as well. These events are called the Atonement. In short, Jesus Christ saves us from sin and death. For that, he is very literally our Savior and Redeemer. In the future Jesus Christ will return to reign on earth in peace for a thousand years. Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and He will be our Lord forever.

http://mormon.org/jesus-christ/


5 posted on 10/07/2011 5:22:23 PM PDT by ilovesarah2012
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To: ilovesarah2012
Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and He will be our Lord forever.

So, what happens when you get your own planet? Tele-worship? Birthday cards?

What about the pitiful people who never got to hear the LDS "gospel" and go to the "telestial kingdom"* and never even get to hang out with Jesus?

*retch

14 posted on 10/07/2011 5:30:42 PM PDT by T Minus Four
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To: ilovesarah2012
But what do we mean when we say He is the Savior of the world? The Redeemer? Each of these titles point to the truth that Jesus Christ is the only way by which we can return to live with our Heavenly Father.

The doctrinal problem between Mormonism and Christianity is not that the LDS believe that Jesus is the only Redeemer. The problem is that Mormons don't believe that Jesus is the only God, and that there is only One God who exists.

Mormons believe that many gods exist and that Jesus is only one god amongst all of them (and not even the most important of them) which is a pagan system. How can you be Christian if you believe that there are many gods? Monotheism is a defining characteristic of Christianity.

38 posted on 10/07/2011 6:00:39 PM PDT by old republic
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To: ilovesarah2012
"Each of these titles point to the truth that Jesus Christ is the only way by which we can return to live with our Heavenly Father"

Christian belief is that life begins at conception. Mormons believe everyone preexists as angels, and some are born into this world. Thus, those that are saved get to "return".

They also believe "As man is, God once was; as God is, man may become.", to quote fifth LDS President Lorenzo Snow. Joseph Smith even said "Here then is eternal life - to know the only wise and true God; and you have got to learn how to be Gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God the same as all Gods have done before you." Brigham Young is quoted saying "The Lord created you and me for the purpose of becoming Gods like Himself."

You could argue these are not mainstream Christian doctrines, but rather are the antithesis of monotheism. Thus, you could argue Romney is not a "Christian".

44 posted on 10/07/2011 6:04:24 PM PDT by jimmyray
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To: ilovesarah2012

Really? Have you ever read the lds article’s of faith?

As an example, you are writing much about the jesus as the only yet lds AofF state:
Articles of Faith: #3 We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel.

Not Grace of Jesus but works by self.

Then there is this question which jesus are you speaking of?
Even your own leaders do not beleive in the Biblical Jesus:
“In bearing testimony of Jesus Christ, President Hinckley spoke of those outside the Church who say Latter-day Saints ‘do not believe in the traditional Christ.’ ‘No, I don’t. The traditional Christ of whom they speak is not the Christ of whom I speak. For the Christ of whom I speak has been revealed in this the Dispensation of the Fullness of Times. He together with His Father, appeared to the boy Joseph Smith in the year 1820, and when Joseph left the grove that day, he knew more of the nature of God than all the learned ministers of the gospel of the ages.’” (LDS Church News Week ending June 20, 1998, p. 7).


50 posted on 10/07/2011 6:08:24 PM PDT by svcw (Those who are easily shocked... should be shocked more often. - Mae West)
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To: ilovesarah2012; Rodentking

And what they leave out is...Jesus is a created being, the spirit brother of Lucifer (who also applied to be Savior btw), that Jesus paid for sins in the Garden not on the cross, but it only kicks in after they have done all they can do and we have to pay Him back with our good works.

Then, let’s not forget, that to them ‘salvation by grace’ is only salvation from physical death (resurrection) and that is free (we will all be resurrected) but exaltation (LDS version of Christian Heaven - living with God) is based upon our membership in the LDS church and good works which will also result in godhood if they are good enough.

And their Jesus killed tens of thousands of unrighteous AFTER HIS CRUCIFIXION (which one leader said was because he was a polygamist) here on the American continent then bragged about it. (3 Nephi 4 - Book of Mormon)

Finally, The LDS Jesus was created by God having sex with Mary (she is one of his plural wives btw as well as being his spirit daughter) and is just like us, except God is his literal physical father (through sex) and thus our ‘elder brother’ Jesus is an example of how we can be morally perfect and live sinless lives on our own accord.

And, yes, I can source ALL of that with writings from LDS leaders, apostles and prophets.


78 posted on 10/07/2011 6:58:26 PM PDT by reaganaut (Ex-Mormon, now Christian "I once was lost but now am found, was blind but now I see".)
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To: ilovesarah2012
But what do we mean when we say He is the Savior of the world? The Redeemer?

 

"He (Joseph Smith) is the man through whom God has spoken... yet I would not like to call him a savior, though in a certain capacity he was a god to us, and is to the nations of the earth, and will continue to be."
 - Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 8:321
 
 
"You call us fools; but the day will be, gentlemen and ladies, whether you belong to this Church or not, when you will prize brother Joseph Smith as the Prophet of the Living God, and look upon him as a god..."
- Herber C. Kimball, Journal of Discourses 5:88
 
 
"If we get our salvation, we shall have to pass by him [Joseph Smith]; if we enter our glory, it will be through the authority he has received. We cannot get around him [Joseph Smith]"
- (as quoted in 1988 Melchizedek Priesthood Study Guide, p. 142)
 
 
There is "no salvation without accepting Joseph Smith. If Joseph Smith was verily a prophet, and if he told the truth...no man can reject that testimony without incurring the most dreadful consequences, for he cannot enter the kingdom of God"
- Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 1, p.190
 
 
"I tell you, Joseph holds the keys, and none of us can get into the celestial kingdom without passing by him. We have not got rid of him, but he stands there as the sentinel, holding the keys of the kingdom of God; and there are many of them beside him. I tell you, if we get past those who have mingled with us, and know us best, and have a right to know us best, probably we can pass all other sentinels as far as it is necessary, or as far as we may desire. But I tell you, the pinch will be with those that have mingled with us, stood next to us, weighed our spirits, tried us, and proven us: there will be a pinch, in my view, to get past them. The others, perhaps, will say, If brother Joseph is satisfied with you, you may pass. If it is all right with him, it is all right with me. Then if Joseph shall say to a man, or if brother Brigham say to a man, I forgive you your sins, "Whosoever sins ye remit they are remitted unto them;" if you who have suffered and felt the weight of transgression—if you have generosity enough to forgive the sinner, I will forgive him: you cannot have more generosity than I have. I have given you power to forgive sins, and when the Lord gives a gift, he does not take it back again."
 - Orson Hyde, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p.154-155
 
 
 
"It is because the Lord called Joseph Smith that salvation is again available to mortal men.... If it had not been for Joseph Smith and the restoration, there would be no salvation,"
 - Bruce McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p. 396, 670
 


They succeeded in killing Joseph, but he had finished his work.
He was a servant of God, and gave us the Book of Mormon.
He said the Bible was right in the main, but, through the translators and others, many precious portions were suppressed, and several other portions were wrongly translated; and now his testimony is in force, for he has sealed it with his blood.
As I have frequently told them, no man in this dispensation will enter the courts of heaven, without the approbation of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Jun.
Who has made this so?
Have I?
Have this people?
Have the world?
No; but the Lord Jehovah has decreed it.
If I ever pass into the heavenly courts, it will be by the consent of the Prophet Joseph.
If you ever pass through the gates into the Holy City, you will do so upon his certificate that you are worthy to pass.
Can you pass without his inspection?
No; neither can any person in this dispensation, which is the dispensation of the fulness of times.
In this generation, and in all the generations that are to come, everyone will have to undergo the scrutiny of this Prophet.
They say that they killed Joseph, and they will yet come with their hats under their arms and bend to him; but what good will it do them, unless they repent?
They can come in a certain way and find favor, but will they?
 Brigham Young,

--JOURNAL OF DISCOURSES, vol. 8, p. 224

84 posted on 10/07/2011 7:26:29 PM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: ilovesarah2012; Godzilla
Only by His mercy and grace can anyone be saved.

Joseph Smith altered the Biblical gospel by claiming in the Book of Mormon that the mainstream teaching for almost 1,000 years in the Americas was a doctrine of the gift of grace only coming AFTER we fulfilled God's legalistic checklist.
He said before grace kicked in, we needed to:
* Do "all you can do" (2 Nephi 25:23, supposedly almost 600 years before Christ)
* Do "works" that would lead to grace somehow being restored (Helaman 12:24, supposedly 6 B.C.)
* "Deny yourselves of all ungodliness, and love God with all your might, mind, and strength," (Moroni 10:32, supposedly written 421 A.D.)

If you did all this, Smith said, you thereby would "earn" grace -- thereby turning the meaning of both "grace" and "gift" on its head!

Anybody failing of doing "all they can do" (morally, emotionally, physically, spiritually, relationally)...or not doing whatever "works" are required...or failing to love God "with all your might, mind, and strength"...or not denying yourselves of "ALL ungodliness"... sorry...Mormon grace doesn't kick in for you!

...You simply, per Smith's Book of Mormon, are not eligible for or “worthy of” God's grace! [I've quoted those BoM verses @ the end of this post so people can read them themselves!]

Since rarely do people heal themselves to go to see the physician to get well, Mormons have it all turned around!!!

Clearly, Joseph Smith did not read or agree with Jesus' words in Matthew 5:31-32:

31And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick. 32I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Jesus came for us sinners. For those who need healing from the GREAT PHYSICIAN. He didn't come for the self-righteous -- those who were so perfected that they already were doing "all they" could do...and were already loving God with ALL their might, mind, and strength...and were already denying ALL aspects of ungodliness!

BoM anti-grace passages:
* 2 Nephi 25:23: ...ye are saved by grace, AFTER ALL YOU CAN DO." (2 Nephi 25:23)

* Helaman 12:24: "...may God grant, in his great fulness, that men might be brought unto repentance and good works, that they MIGHT be restored unto grace for grace, ACCORDING TO THEIR WORKS." (Helaman 12:24)

* Moroni 10:32: “Yea, come unto Christ, and be perfected in him, and deny yourselves of all ungodliness; and IF ye shall deny yourselves of ALL ungodliness, and love God with all your might, mind and strength, THEN is his grace sufficient for you, that by his grace ye may be perfect in Christ; and if by the grace of God ye are perfect in Christ, ye can in nowise deny the power of God.”

175 posted on 10/09/2011 4:58:49 PM PDT by Colofornian
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