Defkalion: “We have Rossi’s formula”

Ny Teknik ^ | Nov 29 2011 | Mats Lewan

[Kevmo]

This will be my standard post to moonboy that says you’re not worth trying to have reasonable discussion, also says “buzz off” & doesn’t leave crickets. But if it offends you to the point that you get it removed like my prior innocuous citation then I’ll have to come up with some other ‘ignore button’ post.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/backroom/2800058/posts?page=55#55
To: Moonman62

This means I have nothing more to say to you about LENR. Bye.

55 posted on Sunday, October 30, 2011 4:41:07 PM by Kevmo (Caveat lurkor pro se ipso judicatis: Let the lurker decide for himself)
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[Kevmo]

Until someone proves to me otherwise, I will operate on the assumption that you are a member of the mob; after all, there was some discussion on that right here on FR.

[Kevmo]

If Rossi’s Ecat turns out a scam, one tragedy is that many people will declare themselves vindicated, despite months of poor logic and lousy arguments that will turn out to have been unrelated to the truth when it comes out.
***Yup. Worth repeating & saving for later.

[Kevmo]

2011/11/25

http://www.mail-archive.com/vortex- href=”mailto:l@eskimo.com”>l@eskimo.com/msg56973.html

For example, one of the charges they sent him to jail for was defrauding the stockholders. He himself was the only stockholder, so this was Kafkaesque. Someone in the Italian justice system had it in for him. — Jed Rothwell

[Moonman62]

Disruptive technology makes waves even among non-technology industries.

When Rossi is arrested -- again -- the reputation of cold fusion is going to be worse than it already is.

[Free Vulcan]

Well taking things with a grain of salt due to Europe’s byzantine regulatory system and lack of legal protections that we have here, I’ll admit Rossi’s past is checkered at least on it’s face.

This is why I’ve never jumped on board and am content to sit back and watch. There are several I’ve read outside of Rossi’s circle that says LENR tech in general might be possible, so I’m hoping that even if Rossi’s is not someone else will develop the ball.

[Kevmo]

This will be my standard post to moonboy that says you’re not worth trying to have reasonable discussion, also says “buzz off” & doesn’t leave crickets. But if it offends you to the point that you get it removed like my prior innocuous citation then I’ll have to come up with some other ‘ignore button’ post.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/backroom/2800058/posts?page=55#55
To: Moonman62

This means I have nothing more to say to you about LENR. Bye.

55 posted on Sunday, October 30, 2011 4:41:07 PM by Kevmo (Caveat lurkor pro se ipso judicatis: Let the lurker decide for himself)
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[Free Vulcan]

This is why I’m skeptical of even the skeptics. You can make anyone look like a crook with the bureaucracies some of these countries have, European ones in particular. If LENR is feasible it will bear itself out, if not with Rossi then someone else.

[Moonman62]

If Rossi’s Ecat turns out a scam, one tragedy is that many people will declare themselves vindicated, despite months of poor logic and lousy arguments that will turn out to have been unrelated to the truth when it comes out.

***Yup. Worth repeating & saving for later.

Don't tell me you think the ecat may turn out to be a scam. You even use a Rossi quote for your tag line.

[Kevmo]

This will be my standard post to moonboy that says you’re not worth trying to have reasonable discussion, also says “buzz off” & doesn’t leave crickets. But if it offends you to the point that you get it removed like my prior innocuous citation then I’ll have to come up with some other ‘ignore button’ post.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/backroom/2800058/posts?page=55#55
To: Moonman62

This means I have nothing more to say to you about LENR. Bye.

55 posted on Sunday, October 30, 2011 4:41:07 PM by Kevmo (Caveat lurkor pro se ipso judicatis: Let the lurker decide for himself)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies | Report Abuse]

[Johnny B.]

Kevmo quoted Jed Rothwell:

For example, one of the charges they sent him to jail for was defrauding the stockholders. He himself was the only stockholder, so this was Kafkaesque. Someone in the Italian justice system had it in for him. — Jed Rothwell

I quote Jed Rothwell (LINK):

> Does anyone have a link for that?
>
No, sorry, I do not. That is what I have heard in conversations with various people. It could be an exaggeration.

- Jed

So, you can either believe an unsubstantiated rumor being spread by some guy who admits he doesn't really know, or you can believe over a decade worth of newspaper stories that include numerous charges, convictions and jail sentences ( LINK).

[Johnny B.]

If Rossi’s Ecat turns out a scam, one tragedy is that many people will declare themselves vindicated, despite months of poor logic and lousy arguments that will turn out to have been unrelated to the truth when it comes out.

You mean like your baseless rumormongering about Rossi's innocence?

[Johnny B.]

Please see message 51 which shows that Jed Rothwell's claim that Rossi was the only stockholder is actually unsubstantiated rumor, probably started by Rossi himself.

I meant to include you in the original post, but forgot to do so.

[dinodino]

Yes, that ridiculous assertion came from muawiyah. You may assume whatever you like; however, there is no evidence linking me in any way to the Mob.

As for the assertion that Rossi is using shell companies for his likely-to-be-scam commercial activities, there is ample evidence which is publicly available on State websites. If you choose to ignore this evidence, you should expect the rest of us to call you out on your intellectual dishonesty.

[Jack of all Trades]

I do not acknowledge the reality of commercially available LENR, only the unproven possibility.

Even commercial installations are subject to standards based equipment design and universally have fire and hazard insurance. When there is damage due to equipment failure, there is liability. For failures of unapproved, nonstandard equipment, the liability falls first on the owner, who will rapidly transfer it to the manufacturer.

Homeowner’s insurance companies don’t assume risk, they manage it. Without a metric for the risk involved, they won’t touch it. There’s just no way to price it.

Again, the Defkalion product brochure pays lip service to agency approvals. Having ushered a few intrinsically safe designs through Factory Mutual approval and even more through UL, I still think certifying a nuclear powered water boiler will be quite a bit more than a slam dunk. Suspending, still for the moment, the disbelief that the device actually works.

[muawiyah]

Oh, yeah, that NASA guy. He was on his own ~ he works at NASA I guess but this was part of his hobby (LENR).

He went to the demo and overlooked the fact this sucker was built out of what appears to be something little changed from a brand new "towable" 1Mwh line battery that (thanks to new tech) can last 5.5 hours ~ and he distracts us by claiming Rossi should have run it 8 hours to prove there was no "chemical reaction".

Bwahahahahahahaha!!!!!

I hope you don't think the NASA guy understood what he was looking at.

Some of our most ardent "it's a scam" folks ALSO laugh at the idea this could just be a large battery (of a type they clearly do not understand). They want us to measure the possible flow of hot water, or secret heating wires, or hot plates, or the effect of a power generator in the vicinity and just pass right past the fact this"battery" could, in fact, be a "battery"!

[muawiyah]

This is your OLD position ~ your start point. That's why we got into some elaborate discussions of these various corporations.

later on you've abandoned "Ampenergo" as meaningful ~ now that we see that the "partners" are also the owners of the LTI they also own.

The "Leonardo Corporation" does not appear to be "LTI" (the name change is significant).

This leaves us with the "It's a Scam" side arguing that Rossi has a shell corporation called Leonardo Corporation, yet he is doing business with another shell corporation called Ampenergo owned by the exact same people as those who own LTI, a company with a $94 million contract with DOE.

On the "We don't know if you have proof that it's a Scam" side we see that Rossi has been around a good long while and the oldest business dealing in the US we find him involved in is back in 1994 ~ earlier he was in Italy ~ to wit, the Petroldragon situation. When he shows up to do business in the US it's as a contractor with LTI then working with Parsons. We do not get a clear link between Rossi and LTI in 1994 other than the references to project events inside the Corps of Engineeers report.

In that same report individuals currently identified as owners of LTI are working on the Parsons project ~ and it seems they might even be DOE employees at the time.

Your side's chief researcher should get us the corporation documents for LTI for 1992, 93, 94 and 95.

[dinodino]

You are truly a mental case! Since when did I “abandon ‘Ampenergo’ as meaningful?” Ampenergo shares an office with Rossi’s company. It is yet another one of his scam companies. You must be confusing me with another poster.

Leonardo Corporation is indeed not LTI, but it’s not a “name change,” as you put it—it was a new corporation formed as Leonardo Corporation by Rossi, and is located in a fifth floor apartment in Miami.

Why don’t you go ahead and give us the full name and State of incorporation for the entity you call, “LTI,” and we’ll take a look.

[Lx]

I must apologize to dinodino. I didn’t think anyone would take it seriously but one.

I was joking when I said he was part of the mob. He’s not; it was a joke actually directed at someone else.

[dinodino]

It’s ok, Lx. Kevmo and muawiyah have a tenuous grasp on reality—if you had called me a grey alien, they would have believed it.