The Haditha Marines-The Squad Leader-A Final Chapter (SSgt Wuterich-Master Thread)

1-2-2012

[smoothsailing]

North County Times now reporting:

Deal might be in works in Wuterich Haditha prosecution

Read more: http://www.nctimes.com/news/local/military/military-deal-might-be-in-works-in-wuterich-haditha-prosecution/article_6a9c37a6-a229-562d-88d2-667258882e23.html#ixzz1jrxVi2jy

[Jemian]

Just off hand, why would Wuterich want to cut a deal? It appears that he’ll be exonerated.

[xzins]

Newsmax, Phil Brennan story from 2008:

Nat Helms, author of the recent book “My Men are Heroes,” has written extensively about Haditha. He said: “Sullivan, who is prosecuting Wuterich, may eventually face some heat of his own for how and why star prosecution witness [Lance Cpl.] Humberto Mendoza managed to get transferred to Sullivan’s Chicago-based reserve unit as a driver after he was granted immunity.

Another article from 2007 USA Today:

Among those provided with immunity to testify are an officer who told troops to raid a house and a sergeant who took photographs of the dead but later deleted them from his camera.

One of the servicemen, Lance Cpl. Humberto Manuel Mendoza, was a member of the squad that cleared several homes and killed the Iraqis in the aftermath of a Nov. 19, 2005 roadside bomb attack that killed one Marine.

Mendoza, who was not charged in the case, told investigators that he shot at least two men, but did so because they were in houses declared hostile.

"I was following my training that all individuals in a hostile house are to be shot," Mendoza told investigators. He was given immunity Dec. 18, just days before the Marine Corps announced murder charges against four enlisted men and dereliction of duty charges against four officers.

[smoothsailing]

I can’t imagine why he would want to, he’s repeatedly proclaimed his innocence. He’s winning his case!

I think the prosecution is grasping at straws in an attempt to save face.

[xzins]

Staff Sergeant Wuterich should not deal with the government if it involves his pleading guilty to anything or accepting any form of non-judicial punishment.

If he does, every newspaper and every history written will in the future begin with the lead sentence: Staff Sergeant Wuterich who admitted ____ was punished by Gen _______ with a letter of reprimand for official file.

[smoothsailing]

DEFEND OUR MARINES EXCLUSIVE---BREAKING NEWS ON FREE REPUBLIC THE TRIAL OF SSGT. WUTERICH: POSSIBLE DEAL IN WORKS

[jazusamo]

Thanks, xzins. I had completely forgotten about those articles and remember them now that you linked them.

[stylin19a]

scratchin my head...what could the prosecution still have that the defense would even consider that deal ?

[smoothsailing]

I agree with you. The defense is winning. The prosecution is losing. I say let them lose, no deals.

[xzins]

Thanks, xzins. I had completely forgotten about those articles and remember them now that you linked them.

No problem, jaz.

A wise man I know uses the following tagline:

If you don't like growing older, don't worry. You may not be growing older much longer

:>)

[jazusamo]

LOL! Well said.

[Lancey Howard]

Dear old Dad always said, “One thing about growing old - - it sure beats the alternative.”

[amom]

.

[Girlene]

Mendoza was granted some kind of immunity for his testimony. Now that he has not given the expected testimony does that mean he will be charged with those charges ignored by virtue of the grant of immunity?

I wondered the same thing, xzin.....that and perjury during the Article 32.

Something's afoot here to have so many prosecution witnesses that are actually proving the defense' case. Too many coincidences, IMO. I tend to think there won't be any blowback for Mendoza.

[xzins]

If it can be proven that NCIS coerced a testimony from him via a threat of deportation after hours of harsh treatment in an interrogation room, I’m all for charging both NCIS and Sean Sullivan with something.

Subornation of perjury for the agents.

Letter of reprimand if Sullivan had knowledge.

And it seems that all of these troops are telling an incredibly similar story of illegal interrogation by NCIS. AS with sexual harrassment, the more accusations the more likely where there’s smoke there’s fire.

[Girlene]

Just off hand, why would Wuterich want to cut a deal? It appears that he’ll be exonerated.

Here's an interesting article in the Los Angeles Times by Tony Perry. Rules of engagement a key issue in Marine's court-martial A few excerpts from the lengthy discussion on the Rules of Engagement/Haditha

............All eight jurors served after that event, which scandalized much of the American public and shook the Marine Corps............

............Wuterich's lawyer, Haytham Faraj, questioned prospective jurors to see whether they could place themselves in the boots of an untested squad leader deployed in the fall of 2005, when the rules for combat may have been different. He asked them if they had served in Iraq, whether they had "cleared" houses and, if so, whether they had fired their weapons.

The answers may not always have been to his liking.

One prospective juror said that before a Marine clears a room by firing his M-16 rifle and throwing grenades (as Wuterich did), he would have to be confident that he was under fire (which Wuterich was not).

That Marine is on the jury.

Nearly all of the prospective jurors said they had experience clearing houses by separating military-age males from women and children. None said they had killed anyone in the process..............

............... So although the rules of engagement may remain the same pre- and post-Haditha, Donovan said, the interpretation is sometimes different, such as with the definition of hostile.......

The article is lengthy, but I think Perry's point is interesting. This may not be a jury of Wuterich's peers. These men served after Haditha.....it doesn't say whether they served before Haditha. They may have a far different opinion of Wuterich's actions not having served prior to this action (Fallujah, etc.) Just a thought....

[Girlene]

Oh, I would say NCIS did some pretty underhanded things in investigating Haditha.....but who will charge them? The military has no jursidiction over NCIS, a civilian agency. I believe the DOJ could......but would they?

[xzins]

If there are concerns with the jury, I can understand to some degree a willingness on Wuterich’s part to cut a deal. At the same time, all of the testimony has been in Staff Sergeant Wuterich’s favor.

Four huge facts are:

1. His Lieutenant ordered him to clear the houses, declaring them hostile.

2. Mendoza said Wuterich gave no orders. Salinas said Wuterich gave no orders.

3. The intel reports about white cars accompanying attacks were permitted to be introduced.

4. Not only was it confirmed they were receiving fire, but Tatum confirmed weapons racking sounds and new evidence was admitted about expended AK47 rounds being inside the houses.

I don’t see how you can slip either a dereliction or a manslaughter conviction through those very solid facts.

What was he supposed to do, draw a cross-hairs on his chest, stand up in the open, and challenge an insurgent to shoot him?

[RedRover]

It speaks volumes that SSgt Wuterich is no hurry to just take a deal. It’s looking now as if we won’t hear anything more until this afternoon. But anything can happen.

[xzins]

I don’t see how you can slip either a dereliction or a manslaughter conviction through those very solid facts.

That's an editorial "you" and not a personal one. I'm not saying that you would want to slip anything through.

Just want to make sure you know that. You are one of the long-term, steadfast posters here, and everyone should know it.