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To: Kansas58

Congress can make anchor babies citizens, that is true, but they cannot amend the United States Constitution Article I without going through the Constitutional amendment process.

Article II and Amendment 14 forms of citizenship are different. All natural born citizens are citizens, but the reverse is not true. Not all citizens are Natural Born Citizens.

Congress has only once defined Natural Born Citizenship in the First Congress, Second Session, which was a person born in the US with two citizen parents. It was a definition found in a law concerning the naturalization process to make clear that NBCs need not go through the naturalization process.

There is no current definition on the books of which I am aware. The former statute, drafted by the framers who wrote the Constitution, is the best evidence of the framers’ intent (found in the second half of the law). Here is the text:

FIRST CONGRESS. SESS. II. CH. 4. 1790

CHAP. III.—An act to establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization.

SECTION 1. Be it enacted by the Senate and Hours of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled. That any alien, being a free white person, who shall have resided within the limits and under the jurisdiction of the United States for the term of two years, may be admitted to become a citizen thereof, on application to any common law court of record in any one of the states wherein he shall have resided for the term of one year at least, and making proof to the satisfaction of such court, that he is a person of good character, and taking the oath or affirmation prescribed by law, to support the constitution of the United States, which oath or affirmation such court shall administer; and the clerk of such court shall record such application, and the proceedings thereon; and thereupon such person shall be considered as a citizen of the United States. And the children of such persons so naturalized, dwelling within the United States, being under the age of twenty-one years at the time of such naturalization, shall also be considered as citizens of the United States. And the children of citizens of the United States, that may be born beyond sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born citizens: Provided, That the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States: Provided also, That no person heretofore proscribed by any state, shall be admitted a citizen as aforesaid, except by an act of the legislature of the state in which such person was proscribed.

APPROVED, March 26, 1790.

Repealed January 29, 1795.

Mark Rubio is not an NBC because his parents did not become citizens (”naturalized”)until after his birth. I understand there are issues with Bobby Jindal as well, though I am not familiar with his case. Others have argued about Romney as well. There may be others. It matters to many people, and it is a rule that should be honored.

The same definition was provided in all of the scholarly legal works at the time of founding.

The only people who disagree with this are those with a non-NBC candidate they are supporting. I see little if any legal authority which challenges this precedent.


94 posted on 02/01/2012 8:44:09 PM PST by LachlanMinnesota (Which are you? A producer, a looter, or a moocher of wealth?)
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To: LachlanMinnesota

“Congress has only once defined Natural Born Citizenship in the First Congress, Second Session, which was a person born in the US with two citizen parents.”

Factually incorrect. The law said that a NBC included those born OVERSEAS of two citizen parents - as was true of the British term, natural born subject.

“and the children of citizens of the United States, that may be born beyond sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born citizens: Provided...”


99 posted on 02/01/2012 8:48:06 PM PST by Mr Rogers ("they found themselves made strangers in their own country")
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To: LachlanMinnesota

“The same definition was provided in all of the scholarly legal works at the time of founding.”

Hmmmm...

“It is an established maxim, received by all political writers, that every person owes a natural allegiance to the government of that country in which he is born. Allegiance is defined to be a tie, that binds the subject to the state, and in consequence of his obedience, he is entitled to protection… The children of aliens, born in this state, are considered as natural born subjects, and have the same rights with the rest of the citizens.”

Zephaniah Swift, A system of the laws of the state of Connecticut: in six books, Volumes 1-2 of A System of the Laws of the State of Connecticut: In Six Book, pg. 163,167 (1795)

“And if, at common law, all human beings born within the ligeance of the King, and under the King’s obedience, were natural-born subjects, and not aliens, I do not perceive why this doctrine does not apply to these United States, in all cases in which there is no express constitutional or statute declaration to the contrary. . . . Subject and citizen are, in a degree, convertible terms as applied to natives, and though the term citizen seems to be appropriate to republican freemen, yet we are, equally with the inhabitants of all other countries, subjects, for we are equally bound by allegiance and subjection to the government and law of the land.”

James Kent, COMMENTARIES ON AMERICAN LAW, pg. 258 (1826)

“As the President is required to be a native citizen of the United States…. Natives are all persons born within the jurisdiction and allegiance of the United States.”

James Kent, COMMENTARIES ON AMERICAN LAW (1826)

“That provision in the constitution which requires that the president shall be a native-born citizen (unless he were a citizen of the United States when the constitution was adopted) is a happy means of security against foreign influence,…A very respectable political writer makes the following pertinent remarks upon this subject. “Prior to the adoption of the constitution, the people inhabiting the different states might be divided into two classes: natural born citizens, or those born within the state, and aliens, or such as were born out of it.”

St. George Tucker, BLACKSTONE’S COMMENTARIES (1803)

“The 5th section of the 2d article provides, “that no person except a natural born citizen,” shall become president. A plain acknowledgment, that a man may become a citizen by birth, and that he may be born such.”

Amy v. Smith, 11 Ky. 326, 340 (Ky. 1822)

“The country where one is born, how accidental soever his birth in that place may have been, and although his parents belong to another country, is that to which he owes allegiance. Hence the expression natural born subject or citizen, & all the relations thereout growing. To this there are but few exceptions, and they are mostly introduced by statutes and treaty regulations, such as the children of seamen and ambassadors born abroad, and the like.”

Leake v. Gilchrist, 13 N.C. 73 (N.C. 1829)

“Therefore every person born within the United States, its territories or districts, whether the parents are citizens or aliens, is a natural born citizen in the sense of the Constitution, and entitled to all the rights and privileges appertaining to that capacity.”

William Rawle, A View of the Constitution of the United States, pg. 86 (1829)

“Before our Revolution, all free persons born within the dominions of the King of Great Britain, whatever their color or complexion, were native-born British subjects; those born out of his allegiance were aliens. . . . Upon the Revolution, no other change took place in the law of North Carolina than was consequent upon the transition from a colony dependent on an European King to a free and sovereign State; . The term ‘citizen,’ as understood in our law, is precisely analogous to the term ’subject’ in the common law, and the change of phrase has entirely resulted from the change of government. The sovereignty has been transferred from one man to the collective body of the people, and he who before as a ’subject of the king’ is now ‘a citizen of the State.”

State v. Manuel, 4 Dev. & Bat. 20, 24-26 (1838)


108 posted on 02/01/2012 8:52:38 PM PST by Mr Rogers ("they found themselves made strangers in their own country")
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To: LachlanMinnesota
Look at your own flawed “logic” on the issue.
There is NO direct, Constitutional definition of NBC.

It is entirely CONSTITUTIONAL, therefore, for CONGRESS to define such terms. Courts, for many years, had to resort to Common Law for a definition of citizenship, itself.

Then, legislation was passed by Congress as to what requirements had to be met, to be a Citizen at Birth.

Hamilton shot another founder in a dual. Adams and Jefferson hated each other.

Our Founders, more than likely, disagreed on many citizenship issues.

This is WHY the definition of citizenship was left to Congress.

142 posted on 02/01/2012 9:14:38 PM PST by Kansas58
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To: LachlanMinnesota
All natural born citizens are citizens, but the reverse is not true. Not all citizens are Natural Born Citizens.
Good to see somebody got to it before I did. I should have read down instead of up after my reply.
Nothing more than a "gotcha" statement.
162 posted on 02/01/2012 9:36:11 PM PST by philman_36 (Pride breakfasted with plenty, dined with poverty, and supped with infamy. Benjamin Franklin)
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To: LachlanMinnesota

All natural born citizens are citizens, but the reverse is not true. Not all citizens are Natural Born Citizens.


Sounds like familiar 7th grade Math logic:
- a square is a rectangle, but a rectangle is not
necessarily a square;
- a diameter is a chord, but a chord is not necessarily a
diameter.


419 posted on 02/02/2012 3:22:09 PM PST by lyby ("Mathematics is the language with which God has written the universe." ~ Galileo Galilei)
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