Posted on 06/29/2012 12:04:52 PM PDT by Kaslin
Two different mandates, but your point might hold. The one that was just challenged that SCOTUS ruled on was the mandate that individuals must buy insurance. The HHS mandate against churches is a regulatory rule stating that all health insurances must include abortions.
The problem occurs if you have a penalty (tax?) for not offering insurance. But also if churches desire to offer insurance.
So it is really two issues. Can congress apply a penalty (tax) to a church for failure to offer insurance. And can Congress limit insurance offerings in such a way that there is no insurance alternative available to churches that don't violate their conscience.
People are given an income tax exemption of $3,800 for each qualifying child.
If I have no children, is that the same thing as being taxed $3,800 for having no children?
-PJ
People are given an income tax exemption $3,800 for each qualifying child.
If I have no children, is that the same thing as being taxed $3,800 for having no children?
Am I being coerced by the government into having children?
-PJ
But they won't find that out, because I think you are right, it will be repealed before they ever see that tax. Which is kind of a shame, because I suspect that a lot of the people who supported this are exactly the same people that would have gotten taxed.
"Avg healthcare cost is $12,800 per employee to companies. The Obamacare fine is $2,000 if you do not provide healthcare to employees. Countless companies in bad financial situations will use this opportunity to drop healthcare...for tens of millions of employees and their families."
I don't follow that. If it costs $12,800 and the fine is $0 today, they have a greater incentive to drop now than before Obamacare.
The only difference is that after Obamacare, companies will know their employees can get group insurance through the government pool. THAT could be the catalyst to causes companies to drop insurance. But the fine actually increases over the next few years, to where it doesn't make sense for companies to drop the insurance at all, because in 4 years the fines will be more than the insurance.
Yes, It is exactly the same as being taxed $3800 for not having kids.
The difference is that children cost a lot more than $3800. And they aren't nearly as convenient as buying health insurance. They're a little bit messy. Thus the incentive doesn't reach the level of coerced.
The difference between an incentive and coerced is just a matter of degree. If children cost only $2400 a year and were convenient, you'd be able to say the government was coercing you to have children.
If I remember correctly, they passed a shell bill in the senate that originated in the house. Trickery.
Actually people with kids should pay MORE taxes not get a tax break (reduction). After all, they should pay for, first, for the schools they use (privatize education - and have parents, singles & seniors wanting life-long-learning classes, etc all pay for the courses in which they enroll). They (families with kids) also use the roads more (soccer practice, trips to dentist for kids braces), the local parks more, and have more economic value (life & private property) protected by police, fire and national defense.
By cutting taxes for large families, you are subsidizing their greater public goods’ use with the tax receipts of smaller families or of singles.
What we need are user fees for local public services (schools, parks, fire stations) and uniform flat or head taxes for truly “public” nationally provided goods (national defense).
Dang... he needs to call up the Supreme’s dressmaker and get a new robe in his favorite color —yellow!
I see your point. But wasn’t the HHS mandate issued as part of Obamacare?
Country is broke
This monstrosity will collapse for lack of funds
The Administration’s lawyer said in oral argument that they never considered the Constitution when writing 0bama Deathcare.
In effect, neither has the Supreme Court’s majority.
I am done with them. All of them.
As for the DOinJ, may I suggest, “get him, guys?” All of his minions and protectors. ALL OF THEM.
The collapse of the US has already begun. Been going on for a few decades.
Watched the collapse of Detroit, while I was living there.
Watched the collapse of California, while I was living there.
There are areas in this country where the police no longer even patrol.
It is collapsing. A slow motion collapse that is accelerating. Best to prepare yourself.
No country last forever. We will have a chance to rebuild some new countries from the ashes of the old.
“It is collapsing. A slow motion collapse that is accelerating. Best to prepare yourself.
No country last forever. We will have a chance to rebuild some new countries from the ashes of the old.”
Maybe too true.
Quote from movie “War Games”!
Stephen Falken: “Now, children, come on over here. I’m going to tell you a bedtime story. Are you sitting comfortably? Then I’ll begin. Once upon a time, there lived a magnificent race of animals that dominated the world through age after age. They ran, they swam, and they fought and they flew, until suddenly, quite recently, they disappeared. Nature just gave up and started again. We weren’t even apes then. We were just these smart little rodents hiding in the rocks. And when we go, nature will start over. With the bees, probably. Nature knows when to give up, David. “
The Mayans actually celebrate that renewal period. Would not go that far myself. But what significantly changed the US was WWII and the Cold War. We had to enlarge and empower the Federal State to win those wars. Those wars are long gone, but the federal behemoth in DC that was created, is still here. It does not want to die. It is grasping at tyrannical straws as it physically collapses. These are its last days.
Yes, but the abortion thing is not codified in the law. Only the HHS department's authority to regulate.
Thus, while their are constitutional challenges to this HHS ruling going on, if successful, they won't invalidate the Obamacare law, only the department's rule.
Can you stay away from Tennessee?
We only deserve it if we do nothing and wait, depending on Republicans in DC for regress is fruitless as evidenced by their past behavior.
That defeats the intent of the constitution and should be unconstitutional.
Maybe someone should sue based on that.
That defeats the intent of the constitution and should be unconstitutional.
Maybe someone should sue based on that.
The Federal Behemoth you mention is a body of persons elected by us citizens.
They were sworn in to abide by the laws of our Republic, the Constitution, to guide us through perilous times. When they endeavor to destroy this country then it is “We The People” who have to act.
I’m not suggesting criminal action, just excising the cysts that exists in our present government(?). Although I agree with the 2nd Amendment!
I’m in Florida and doing what I can to excise the boil on Florida’s a$$, called Bill Nelson!
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