Skip to comments.Permit not needed for stormwater runoff, court says
Posted on 11/02/2013 1:28:31 PM PDT by artichokegrower
Threatened with huge fines and possible imprisonment, West Virginia poultry producer Lois Alt decided to stand up to the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency in court. In a case with implications for livestock producers in California and nationwide, Alt tried to sort out whether stormwater discharges from her farm actually require a federal permit. Her case won support from the West Virginia and American Farm Bureaus, which intervened in the court case on her behalf.
Last week, Alt won an important decision when the U.S. District Court for the Northern District of West Virginia ruled against EPA, saying that ordinary stormwater from Alt's farmyard is exempt from National Pollutant Discharge Elimination System permit requirements.
Alt filed suit against EPA in June 2012, after the agency threatened her with $37,500 in fines each time stormwater came into contact with dust, feathers or small amounts of manure on the ground outside of her poultry houses as a result of normal farm operations. EPA also threatened separate fines of $37,500 each day if Alt failed to apply for an NPDES permit for such stormwater discharges.
"This lawsuit was about EPA's tactic of threatening farmers with enormous fines in order to make them get permits that are not required by law," American Farm Bureau Federation President Bob Stallman said. "Lois Alt was proud of her farm and her environmental stewardship, and she stood her ground. We're proud to have supported her effort."
Alt operates an eight-house chicken farm with a ventilation system and a covered litter storage shed, a compost shed and feed storage bins.
(Excerpt) Read more at agalert.com ...
Anyhow what is a "water of the United States"?
Amongst other things, rainwater, if you store it without a permit, you can be charged, if you let it run off your land you can be charged.
” threatening farmers with enormous fines in order to make them get permits that are not required by law,”
That is the EXACT definition of FELONY EXTORTION.
You can bet the farm that the EPA zealots are not going to let this pass.
Before the end of Lord Obamas term there will be a new rule out of the EPA to force these farmers to get the permits that these petty bureaucratic dictators want.
The EPA has determined that in order to prevent pollution, it has authority to criminalize anything that might become pollution even before such pollution occurs. It has also determined that it is essential to do this before any legal proceeding has occurred. It will continue to do this until it is stopped. To date it has increased its scope far beyond any limit envisioned from its establishment.
Note: Carbon Dioxide has been ruled a pollutant by the EPA.
All animals live by giving off Carbon Dioxide.
I’ve heard of chicken-shit laws, but this is the real deal.
Stalin did it with police, dogs and barbed wire... while literally millions died in the Ukrainian Holodomor of 1932-1933. Obama...?
I hate this tyranny.
Sooooo..... pay the government some money and they'll let you do what they don't want people to do.
Sounds like a bribe.....
All plants live by breathing this “pollution.” And without plants, we all DIE.
Extend this to all government bureaucracies and their denizens. It is a simple fact of life, nobody likes to work harder than they have to and that to a bureaucrat there is a very real difference between a small business/farmer/retailer etc. and their big brothers.
An inspector goes to Megacorp to see about a possible violation. He is met and escorted by an employee whose only job that day is to satisfy him. It is a government cog meeting an industrial cog, bureaucrat to bureaucrat. GovGuy gets to talk, have a cup of whatever, discuss the problem in a comfortable environment and leaves that day having done his job with satisfaction. Makes no difference to either person if the problem is there, for the most part neither of their jobs is on the line or in danger.
Contrast this with the same problem at MikeInc. GovGuy goes there and there is nobody who can be assigned to answer his questions. It is a small shop with everybody wearing more than one hat. There is no place for GovGuy to check on documentation and nobody to understand his take on the RULES! Any violations he finds could mean the end of the business and GovGuy would just feel terrible about that. But that is his job so he does it, after all nobody should go into business without knowing all of the rules, right?
So, which size business do you think government likes the best?
Don't tell me, tell the EPA, I'm sure that they will listen to you very carefully! Please don't mention my name or alias, then again what am I saying, the NSA can get that to them in a heartbeat. Bye-the-bye, which group has a greater membership in the ranks of the EPA, the combined total of (Republicans, Libertarians and NRA) OR The Sierra Club?
Ya know, one of these days, some rancher or farmer is going to decide that fighting in court with these tyrants isn’t worth the time.
Instead, they will carry out their own form of justice on these bastards. And they will deserve what they get.
The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there arent enough criminals, one makes them.
Well as long as we have this administration there should not be a shortage of criminals.
And all vegetation lives by inhaling Carbon Dioxide.
Hmmm... almost as if it was planned that way from the beginning.
This is a very important ruling with great implications for reeling in runaway governmental agencies. Provided it is decided this way where it ultimately will end up.
And all leftists give off carbon dioxide. What did Saul Alinsky say? Oh yea, make the enemy live by their own rules.
Oh I wasn’t telling you. You my FRiend clearly know. I was telling the lurkers. BTW Hi, NSA pukes...
“Instead, they will carry out their own form of justice on these bastards. And they will deserve what they get.”
At one time, revenooers would disappear after venturing into Appalachia, and no one ever saw anything.
Breathing has finally been made illegal. We’re all criminals now. We exude plant food and it turns out to be agin the law.
The answer is to infiltrate the EPA with conservative republicans.
So the lesson for MikeInc. and any small farm operation is to set up Procedures and Training for when any gov’t official arrives. All staff needs to know who in supervision/management is immediately called and the location where the gov’t official is to wait until that person arrives.
Not to worry the EPA has lots of our money to spend appealing this decision to a higher court.
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“The answer is to infiltrate the EPA with conservative republicans.”
One of the many failures of George W. Bush was not reshaping the bureaucracy. Democrat Presidents do not make this mistake. Whenever they are in power they do their best to insert ideologues in positions of authority in every agency.
In I believe Seattle, you can be arrested for catching rainwater in a bucket.
Fining folks for “Acts of God” which were one of the few areas normally exempted (shovel your walk and someone slips and it’s on you:::leave it Au-natural after God dumped snow on it and you are in the clear).
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