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To: caww; Longbow1969
EU/US/Nato expansion has marched right along , defying the agreements this would not occur.

There was no agreement between NATO and Russia wherein NATO would refuse to accept former Soviet-bloc states who wanted to join. And why shouldn't they be allowed to join? After all, Russia has a long history of invading its weaker, smaller neighbors. How do you think Russia got so big in the first place? An agreement with NATO would require all of NATO formerly recognizing it. There is no such thing as a secret agreement or an "understanding" that is in any way binding.

He's been warning the EU/US ever since they went after the Baltics and now others in their pipeline....heck even before that. So what did they expect going after Ukraine??? A hand out?

IOW, you are claiming that Russia has the right to bully, rape and murder countries that do not want to be forever trapped under the Comintern's control.

We are sooooo being used, and drained, by EU's quest for power as a Nation State of it's own because our government is in lockstep with the EU's agenda ....

Notice that in all of this rambling nonsense you never once actually consider the opinion of the Ukrainians themselves. To you, they are a non-entity, to be butchered by Russia if they hold to the wrong opinion.

88 posted on 05/02/2014 6:44:01 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans
There was no agreement between NATO and Russia wherein NATO would refuse to accept former Soviet-bloc states who wanted to join. And why shouldn't they be allowed to join?

Agreed, though Russian paranoia is a fact of life and we do have to consider that when admitting new members. Right or wrong, Russia may feel NATO membership for Ukraine is just a bridge too far. Call it national pride, or considering Ukraine its national buffer, or whatever, any Russian government may recoil at this. Still, your point is spot on. A free Ukraine should be able to petition to join whatever organization it wants.

To me the lesson is this: Don't give up your nukes. Never, ever, give up your nukes. If Ukraine had them today, things would be a whole lot different. At minimum, the Ukraine could use them as leverage to get a lot more Western help just by hinting they might use them to defend their territory.

89 posted on 05/02/2014 6:54:14 PM PDT by Longbow1969
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

91 posted on 05/02/2014 7:15:10 PM PDT by caww
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