Posted on 02/12/2015 9:50:41 AM PST by Mount Athos
In early February 2015 an interesting study, “The Socio-Political Sentiments in Crimea,” was released by the Ukrainian branch of GfK, the well-known German social research organization, as part of the Free Crimea initiative. Intriguingly, the primary objective of this project, launched with the support of the Canada Fund for Local Initiatives, was to “debunk aggressive Russian propaganda” and to “reintegrate Crimea into Ukraine.” Thus the researchers can hardly be suspected of being Russian sympathizers. So let’s take a look at the results.
The attitudes of Crimeans were studied in January 2015. This representative sample included 800 respondents living on the peninsula, from all age and social categories.
In answer to the most important question: “Do you endorse Russia’s annexation of Crimea?” 82% of the respondents answered “yes, definitely,” and another 11% – “yes, for the most part.” Only 2% gave an unambiguously negative response, and another 2% offered a relatively negative assessment. Three percent did not specify their position.
excerpt
Considering 80% of Crimea’s residents speak Russian, the findings correlate very well with last year’s referendum.
Crimeans consider themselves Russian and it was only an accident of history the territory was ever ceded to Ukraine.
Borders should be respected don’t you think?
Otherwise Mexico has the right to invade LA and Chicago
China can take over every Chinatown
And we can start taking China, Japan, and every other country....because we have people there.
Isn’t it interesting that none of your, I mean Russian’s, logic can be taken apart in a sentence or two?
Mexicans have already conquered Los Angeles and indeed all of California. It is only a matter of time until the Mexican flag supplants the Stars and Stripes.
Of course they should be... until you realize the USSR was a dictatorship and Crimeans were never asked if they wanted to be in Ukraine.
Beat me to it .....
;-)
Do they have polls in the Ukraine and Russia asking them if they endorse what's happening ini the U.S. Like massive government oppression and intrusion while keeping it's violent borders wide open?
Or do ya think anyone in the Ukraine or Russia gives a s**t?
Maybe memory does not serve but at the end of the second war, Stalin demanded from the UK, the US, France, etc. that Russia should have TWO votes in the UN to represent the USSR and the Ukraine.
Truman and the others said NO, the Ukraine IS in the USSR so only ONE vote for the USSR in the UN.
Up to now that has been the case, I think.
Now what, we go and fight to force Russia OUT when we have always stood by the ‘Ukraine = Russia’ idea?
Is that correct?
Yes Russia was never going to let anything endanger that military port on the Baltic Sea. Putey was going to take back the Crimea and that’s just the way its going to be. The sooner they all agree about where to put the new border the better things will be. Prolonging this war in the Ukraine is poor idea.
Actually Stalin got three votes for the USSR—one for Russia, one for Ukraine, one for Byelorussia (Belarus). I think this was agreed to by FDR at Yalta. Ukraine and Belarus are listed as members of the UN from 1945.
Does Putin want to bring all of Ukraine under his control, or will he allow the western part to retain independence? If so, will it be like Finland during the Cold War (internally free but having to be careful not to anger its neighbor) or like Vichy France?
Ukraine has been a part of Russia for at least 500 years. Prior to that it could be argued that Russia was a cultural subsect, and at times a political fiefdom of Kiev and their Grand Princes. It was the Grand Prince Vladimir who brought Orthodox Christianity to the Slavs. This bizarre idea that Ukraine has some identity separate from Russia can only be explained by the widespread historical illiteracy on the part of so many Americans.
I have no use for Putin who is a KGB spy/mafia godfather that somehow became President. But the fact remains that we cannot just pretend Russia has no vital interests outside of the borders arbitrarily created after the break up of the USSR. Russia survived the invasions by Napoleon and Hitler in large measure because of the vast depth, and brutal winter climate of Ukraine. The relationship between the two has not always been smooth, and times it has been repressive. But if you date it to the conversion of the Slavs then it is over a thousand years old.
US and NATO meddling in countries that directly border Russia is deeply resented by the Russians, and that’s not just Putin and his ultranationalist cronies. The people resent it in the same way we resented the USSR when they set up an anti-American satellite state in Cuba and the way I am certain that we would be furious if the Russians were interfering in Mexico or Canada the way we have been openly interfering in Ukraine. Putin may may be a thug, but that doesn’t mean this is any of our business. It isn’t.
Given the history mentioned above, Russia considers Ukraine’s relationship to Moscow as a matter of vital national security, IMO understandably. The question we need to ask ourselves is, are we willing to go to war against Russia in a part of the world that has a history of swallowing foreign invaders and then freezing them to death in order to continue our policy of encirclement? Because if push comes to shove, I think Russia is prepared to go to war to prevent Ukraine from becoming a part of a hostile military alliance.
I would suggest that some very sober reflection is in order with regards the limits of US military power, and where our legitimate vital national interests end.
Well we will find out soon enough as they just announced an agreement today.
Sure. BTW- Southern California should belong to Mexico too I guess.
and they will find a lot of support on FR too
Well said.
Hindsight suggests that threatening Russia with loss of control of the Crimea by trying to bring the Ukraine into NATO was not a particularly bright move. We really waved the red flag when we put a detachment of U.S. Marines in Sebastopol back in ...2006, was it? Sometimes the better part of diplomacy is to accept the inevitable, and it now seems certain that Russia will do whatever may be necessary to restore and secure its Black Sea ports, including the land ways necessary to their supply and defense.
Our arguments based on “international law” seem strained, at best. Had you taken a poll several years ago, most people would have betrayed the belief that Crimea was part of Russia, from time immemorial. However gratifying the thought of spiting Putin may be, our “national interests” here are hardly of such magnitude as to justify the costs such efforts will entail.
Berezovets is inclined to credit Crimea’s “Orwellian atmosphere” for some of that near-unanimity. He’s probably right. Given the ubiquitous FSB attention and the arrest of some pro-Ukrainian activists — the persecution of filmmaker Oleg Sentsov is the cause celebre — as “extremists,” few people are likely to be brave enough to condemn the annexation on the phone, especially when the caller is a stranger. In Russia itself, polls show 85 percent support for Putin, but it’s hard to calculate how much of that is motivated by caution: it’s best to treat those numbers as an indication that most people are willing to acquiesce rather than to protest.
could be....before that the Tatars were there. But Russians came in and killed all of them too.
Have you noticed a pattern of Russia yet?
Can’t quite put my finger on it, but it would seem makes a habit of destroying civilizations. But as long as you can convince yourself you’re right, I guess that’s all that matters.
Disingenuously someone only translated part of the survey. One of its great problems is the telephone survey was conducted of people in towns 200,000 or larger therefore ending in over representing the russians and under representing everyone else(Tatars) who live in small communities. In the survey 77% were russian, 12% Ukrainian and 2% were Tatar. Also many Ukrainians left Crimea. The 2001 census showed almost 40% of Crimea was non russian.
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