Gore Vidal: The Man and the Writer [Remember when Bill Buckley Called Him "Queer" On National TV?]

National Review ^ | 08/29/2015 | Ron Capshaw

[SeekAndFind]

Here is the complete exchange

Here is the clip where Vidal called Buckley a CRYPTO-NAZI and Buckley countered by calling him QUEER

[SeekAndFind]

The climactic moment of the movie, as it was of the debates, comes after the moderator, Howard K. Smith, refers to the fact that some of the antiwar demonstrators in Grant Park had brandished Vietcong flags prior to the police onslaught. Here, in full, is the relevant frank exchange of views:

SMITH: Mr. Vidal, wasn’t it a provocative act to try to raise the Vietcong flag in the park in the film we just saw? Wouldn’t that invite—raising the Nazi flag during World War II would have had similar consequences.

VIDAL: You must realize what some of the political issues are here. There are many people in the United States who happen to believe that the United States policy is wrong in Vietnam and the Vietcong are correct in wanting to organize their own country in their own way politically. This happens to be pretty much the opinion of Western Europe and many other parts of the world. If it is a novelty in Chicago, that is too bad, but I assume that the point of the American democracy—

BUCKLEY: (interrupting): —and some people were pro-Nazi—

VIDAL: —is you can express any view you want—

BUCKLEY: —and some people were pro-Nazi—

VIDAL: Shut up a minute!

BUCKLEY: No, I won’t. Some people were pro-Nazi and, and the answer is they were well treated by people who ostracized them. And I’m for ostracizing people who egg on other people to shoot American Marines and American soldiers. I know you don’t care—

VIDAL (loftily): As far as I’m concerned, the only pro- or crypto-Nazi I can think of is yourself. Failing that—

SMITH: Let’s, let’s not call names—

VIDAL: Failing that, I can only say that—

BUCKLEY (snarling, teeth bared): Now listen, you queer, stop calling me a crypto-Nazi or I’ll sock you in your goddam face, and you’ll stay plastered—

(Everybody talks at once. Unintelligible.)

SMITH: Gentlemen!

[SamuraiScot]

“That was political,” Newman replied. “Yours was personal.”

Newman, you self-righteous dork. You were too old-fashioned to admit that the "personal," where homosexuality was concerned, had already become political.

[virgil283]

Its funny that I saw that particular program. We were in a isolated area and only one channel could be picked up so we were watching it when all the cursing began...Shocked I tell you.

Vidal was being a jerk and provoked it...

[Mikey_1962]

The Gore is the same Gore as Al Gore as they are family

[Politicalkiddo]

“Now listen, you queer, stop calling me a crypto-Nazi or I’ll sock you in your G****** face, and you’ll stay plastered—”

Charming fellow.

[IronJack]

Vidal would argue that the very lack of proof of a military–industrial cabal was evidence enough of its existence

And THAT, my FRiends, is the core of liberal "logic." If you see it, it's proof that it exists. But even if you don't, it's still proof. In other words, even if it's not there, it's there. Because you can't find it.

[mountn man]

Nope, 2 different families.

[Cyman]

Vidal was strictly homosexual and displayed a detectable self-loathing about this.

Here is the Cliff note version.

[SeekAndFind]

The surprising thing to me is — This was ALLOWED on National TV ( back when colored TV was rare ).

I’m not sure if that will be allowed in today’s PC world.

[SeekAndFind]

RE: Vidal was strictly homosexual and displayed a detectable self-loathing about this.

Here is what he wrote (from WIkipedia ):

“We are all bisexual to begin with. That is a fact of our condition. And we are all responsive to sexual stimuli from our own as well as from the opposite sex. Certain societies at certain times, usually in the interest of maintaining the baby supply, have discouraged homosexuality. Other societies, particularly militaristic ones, have exalted it. But regardless of tribal taboos, homosexuality is a constant fact of the human condition and it is not a sickness, not a sin, not a crime ... despite the best efforts of our puritan tribe to make it all three. Homosexuality is as natural as heterosexuality. Notice I use the word ‘natural,’ not normal.”

[Alas Babylon!]

Reminds me of their take on Global Warming!

[Lisbon1940]

I don’t know anything about his personal life. His historical fiction is fantastic.

[miss marmelstein]

A great novelist and a great essayist. He’s unsurpassed in modern American literary criticism. Eat your heart out, Mr. Buckley, you couldn’t come close to “Burr” or “Lincoln.”

[originalbuckeye]

Bkmk

[goodnesswins]

So...if I were to read ONE Gore Vidal book...which should it be?

[IronJack]

And the argument is a tautology. It cannot be defeated because the "logic" doesn't branch. There is no separate conclusion for "x" and "not x." Both arrive at the same point, a point arbitrarily chosen by the advocate, and one that permits of no deviation.

It is fruitless to try to counter such an argument, based as it is on that foundation. Ridicule, exaggeration, and equal intolerance are the only weapons against such idiocy.

[miss marmelstein]

Read two. Lincoln which is magnificent and Burr which is still dying to be made into a movie. His take on Burr and Washington is fun and witty. Lincoln is just...amazing. And what’s great about him is he’s a straightforward writer. None of the Hillary Mantel pretentious present tense nonsense.

[IronJack]

A little research shows you to be correct. But I’ve got my own lyrics so stuck in my head I doubt the real ones will ever take.

[goodnesswins]

Thanks...