Canadian healthcare: The doctor will see you eventually

One News Now ^ | 9/21/17 | Chris Woodward

[Sopater]

Americans would be better off with government-paid healthcare, claims a Canadian doctor, but a fellow Canadian says the wait times may literally kill you.

"I don't recommend it," Canadian health care broker Rick Baker says of Canada's "single payer" healthcare system, which is held up by liberals as a healthcare system for Americans to emulate.

In a USA Today op-ed, hospital administrator Dr. Danielle Martin writes that the Canadian system outperforms the U.S. on quality and access to care despite "nasty rumors" in the U.S. media about the quality of care.

She goes on to acknowledge that Canadians "sometimes wait too long" for non-urgent or elective procedures but claims the Canadian government and healthcare workers are "working hard" to improve access to hip replacements, cataract surgery and other procedures deemed non-urgent.

She goes on to claim that Canadians always receive urgently-needed care and never see a bill.

Baker, who lives in West Vancouver, British Columbia, points out the World Health Organization rates his country poorly among other industrialized nations.

A survey of 11 industrialized countries, in fact, found that Canada's wait times came in dead last, a Canadian newspaper reported in February. One-third of Canadians reported they waited four hours or more for emergency room care and 56 percent said they waited four weeks or longer to see a specialist, also the worst average.

Citing WHO figures, a Canadian healthcare website shows Canada leads the U.S. but still ranks No. 30 worldwide while the U.S. is No. 37.

The quality of a surgical procedure in Canada is "fine" once you go under the knife, says Baker, but most procedures are considered elective with the exception of imminent death or loss of a limb.

"If you're hit by a bus, that's not an elective thing," he explains. "If, however, you have rheumatoid arthritis, and it's attacked your hip joint and you're waiting two years to get surgery as many people do in Canada, in that time the rheumatoid arthritis will be on the hip joint and it'll attack your pelvis and you'll be in a heck of a situation."

That's a situation in Baker is familiar with: His wife has rheumatoid arthritis and got surgery in the United States.

"The soonest that she could get a hip replacement (in Canada) was five months," says Baker. "Her doctor in Phoenix, Arizona told her that if she waited five months, he would have to replace part of her pelvis in addition to your hip joint. But the Canadian system doesn't recognize that."

Meanwhile, a typical Canadian family of four will pay $12,057 for health care this year, an increase of approximately 70 percent over the last 20 years.

[OldMissileer]

Wealthy Canadians, Brits and others flee here for timely medical care. That should tell us SOMETHING!

I was stationed at Grand Forks, North Dakota, from 1985 to 1992. The hospital up there was very large and modern and has expanded even further since I left.

Back then a majority of their patients and income were from Canadians and if you traveled through their parking lot most of the vehicles had Canadian license plates. One of my friends is still a doctor there and the numbers remain the same.

[olezip]

"I don't recommend it," Canadian health care broker Rick Baker says of Canada's "single payer" healthcare system, which is held up by liberals as a healthcare system for Americans to emulate.

The liberals already have a system that emulates the Canadian health care system, especially while the Democrats were in control. It is call the Veterans Administration.

Many of our esteemed veterans died while waiting for the VA to schedule an appointment. Billions of dollars were wasted with incompetent management of this single payer system.

The Trump Administration is creating a VA that will actually properly and promptly service our veterans.

[Sopater]

Why isn’t any government anywhere trying free choice, free association of doctors and patients and the free market?

Because that would require a government to remain "hands-off", which no acting government is ever willing to do.

[Snowyman]

Danny Williams was the Primer of Newfoundland. In February 2010 he went to Mount Sinai Medical Center, Miami for a heart operation.

It’s February and you’re a multi millionaire. Where would you like to spend your time recovering ? At your condo , Summer Cove on Siesta Key or in Newfoundland.

[DoughtyOne]

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Just $542.00 dollars to 97.00%

[Gay State Conservative]

It’s February and you’re a multi millionaire. Where would you like to spend your time recovering ? At your condo , Summer Cove on Siesta Key or in Newfoundland.

OK,fair enough...a Canadian "standing on guard" for his homeland.Understandable.

First a comment and then a question:

If I need heart surgery I'm going to the very best hospital and surgeon I can afford.I have a plan that allows me to go to just about any hospital and surgeon in the US.I'd go to the Mayo Clinic in January (rumor has it that it gets nippy in Minnesota in January) or I'd go to Saudi Arabia in July (rumor has it that it gets a bit toasty there in July).It depends on where the best care can be found.My hunch is that the same is true for you.

And now my question: Isn't it true that Mr Williams' choice created a huge controversy up north? Isn't it true that newspapers nationwide wrote editorials slamming his choice as unpatriotic...a betrayal of everything that Canadians hold sacred? Isn't it true that people nationwide wrote letters to the editor slamming his choice?

Just sayin'...

[Sam Gamgee]

Which is why, generally, young people have less problem with the system. I live in British Columbia. Last year to budget for healthcare (50% of the budget) only was increased 3%. This while the province grows and the share of elderly grows. So there is only one option - rationing care.

Canada came into this experiment in the 1950s at the golden beginning of the demographic pyramid. So it worked awesome when we had 12 workers to 1 retiree. The US wants to start this system at the worst point of entry, where the worker to retiree ratio is at a low extreme. The US better find that money tree to shake.

[Sam Gamgee]

Use to be an hour wait, although with my doctor it improved to about 20 to 30 minutes. However, I am limited to TWO complaints per visit. So say one medication refill and to talk about my bad knee.

[Sam Gamgee]

I wonder who compiled that number. Canada has pretty progressive extremes in its tax system. There is no way my family of 6 paid that much in taxes in total. We have pretty large deductions; one for our Christian private school and another for my wives college expenses.

But I do get the point. There was an idea floated that was soon dumped, that the government would send a mock bill for expensive surgeries to patients. For example, someone who had heart surgery would get a bill demonstrating how the cost came to say $25,000. They wouldn’t have to pay it, but it would demonstrate that healthcare is NOT free. The media was all over it, saying it “guilted” BC residents, and it was dumped.

[Sam Gamgee]

There apparently is an unofficial back door system, at least I have heard. For instance politicians and hockey players some how get top billing in any wait lists.

[Sam Gamgee]

OK, my boss was away for a year for depression having lost his baby in delivery. Apparently a student doctor reviewed his wife’s condition and said she was NOT in labor, when in fact she was. When he called much later the student’s school they said he had no authorization to make a call like that without a supervisor present. Long story short, with the doctors and hospital coldly ignoring the wife’s concerns and pain, the baby lost too much oxygen and was born brain dead.

Now while I don’t like the wild west of personal injury law in the US, in Canada you are shit out of luck. They spoke to lawyers who said the baby had no economic value (like a working adult would) so there could be no compensation on that front. At best, after spending thousands of dollars on legal fees they were advised the best they could hope for in compensation would be $3000.

The moral to this story is the state decides your health and if they royally screw it up, it is next to impossible to hold them to account.

[littleharbour]

You are 100% correct. Canadian courts rarely award punitive damages and even then amounts are low. You’re usually stuck with compensatory damages so lost income and, if you’re severely disabled, some level of personal care.

[Snowyman]

If I recall correctly it was first said the procedure wasn’t available in Canada, I know for certain it was not available in Newfoundland. Then it was said it was available in Toronto and a couple of other cities. Williams had a choice, most don’t . Given you have a $1.5 million condo close by in Florida where would you choose to recuperate after having a 6 hour heart operation ?

Last November I was diagnosed with Prostrate Cancer.
My journey began by walking into to a Walk-in-Clinic to see a doctor ( at that time I did not have a family doctor, I do now ) . The next morning I had blood work and an ultra sound ( at another private clinic), a 4 day wait to see the Dr. for the results , a 10 day wait for a Urologist, a 2 week wait for a TRUS biopsy and another 10 day wait for results ,
In January , a MRI bone scan, a CT soft tissue scan and then a 14 day wait to see an Oncologist who suggested 3 months of hormone treatment . Then in early May , a CT simulation and tattooing , then 33 radiation sessions ending in July.
The first Dr forgot to check off one box on the form and it cost me $35 for the PSA test. Had he checked it I wouldn’t have had to pay.
I’m not done yet. I have years of follow-up appointments and tests but right now..I feel great.

Everyone has their story about Canadian healthcare, it’s not perfect, not by a long shot, but not once did I question or worry how I was going to pay for all this stuff . I just presented my OHIP card. Ontario catches me with a health care tax based on my income, up to $900 and Employers pay a 1.9% pay roll health tax. Anyone who says it’s rationed is BSing you. My dad is 92 and has end stage kidney disease. He gets the best care and treatment but as with old people, his age eliminates many treatments, like dialysis or transplant , available to younger people.