Posted on 06/11/2018 1:22:59 PM PDT by Mrs. Don-o
This is getting less and less productive as it goes on. I have strawberry ice cream waiting for me. Adieu.
Romans 6:12-18 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, to make you obey its passions. Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace.
What then? Are we to sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means! Do you not know that if you present yourselves to anyone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness? But thanks be to God, that you who were once slaves of sin have become obedient from the heart to the standard of teaching to which you were committed, and, having been set free from sin, have become slaves of righteousness.
If you continue to live in wanton sin after we're saved, presuming on God's grace, then you haven't repented of the sin.
Repenting means turning from it to Christ.
It doesn't mean we won't struggle with the sin that so easily besets us, but the new godly nature we have no longer has the desire to sin.
We often get stuck in Romans 7 cause of that.
Read this from Got Questions... I think it is a fair, though brief discussion.
I believe the key idea is that some sins by believers lead to premature death.
This is not eternal death, but physical death.
If you have more questions, please ask.
Question: "What is the sin unto death?"
Answer: First John 5:16 is one of the most difficult verses in the New Testament to interpret. “If anyone sees his brother commit a sin that does not lead to death, he should pray and God will give him life. I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that he should pray about that.” Of all the interpretations out there, none seem to answer all the questions concerning this verse.
The best interpretation may be found by comparing this verse to what happened to Ananias and Sapphira in Acts 5:1–10 (see also 1 Corinthians 11:30). The “sin unto death” is willful, continuous, unrepentant sin. God has called His children to holiness (1 Peter 1:16), and God corrects them when they sin. We are not “punished” for our sin in the sense of losing salvation or being eternally separated from God, yet we are disciplined. “The Lord disciplines the one he loves, and he chastens everyone he accepts as his son” (Hebrews 12:6).
First John 5:16 says there comes a point when God can no longer allow a believer to continue in unrepentant sin. When that point is reached, God may decide to take the life of the stubbornly sinful believer. The “death” is physical death. God at times purifies His church by removing those who deliberately disobey Him. The apostle John makes a distinction between the “sin that leads to death” and the “sin that does not lead to death.” Not all sin in the church is dealt with the same way because not all sin rises to the level of the “sin that leads to death.”
In Acts 5:1–10 and 1 Corinthians 11:28–32, God dealt with intentional, calculated sin in the church by taking the physical life of the sinner. This is perhaps also what Paul meant by “the destruction of the flesh” in 1 Corinthians 5:5.
John says that we should pray for Christians who are sinning, and that God will hear our prayers. However, there may come a time when God decides to cut short a believer’s life due to unrepentant sin. Prayers for such an unheeding person will not be effective.
God is good and just, and He will eventually make us “a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless” (Ephesians 5:27). To further that end, God chastens His children. May the Lord preserve us from the hard-heartedness that would cause us to commit the “sin unto death.”
You are correct sir. You know I live in a south sea island paradise. I would say the majority of the the true Christians I fellowship with, are ex Catholics. I even know two ex Muslims.
Just recently, I had the pleasure of leading my brother in law’s fiancé and her sister, out of the Roman Catholic Church, into a saving knowledge of true faith in Jesus. I told them that I didn’t care what church they attended, but ALL OF US have to be saved the same way. There are NO EXCEPTIONS. They were both English majors in College, so they are fluent in English, as opposed to my brother in law, who cannot hardly get one sentence out in English. I talked with them for a couple hours. Then, they looked at each other, and started talking to each other, in their own language. Then, they turned to me, and in English, said they were pretty sure I was telling them the truth, and they wanted to go to Heaven, but they wanted to get more information from me. In a couple of months, they both left the church ⛪ It’s been a pleasure, to see a change in their lives. I think one thing in my favor, is the fact that they are fascinated by Americans, so they enjoyed listening to me. They both have told me they will be eternally grateful to me, that I loved them enough to tell them the truth about TRUE faith in God. 😁😇
You did NOT specify the so called sacrament of confession. You simply said that former Catholics were former Catholics because they were dishonest.
Besides, the Scripture verse you posted still condemns Catholicism because by that standard, Catholics do not confess according to Scriptural mandate, that is openly.
Going into a confessional is not confessing openly.
And again, context destroys your misapplication of the verse.
Acts 19:14-20 Seven sons of a Jewish high priest named Sceva were doing this. But the evil spirit answered them, “Jesus I know, and Paul I recognize, but who are you?” And the man in whom was the evil spirit leaped on them, mastered all of them and overpowered them, so that they fled out of that house naked and wounded.
And this became known to all the residents of Ephesus, both Jews and Greeks. And fear fell upon them all, and the name of the Lord Jesus was extolled. Also many of those who were now believers came, confessing and divulging their practices. And a number of those who had practiced magic arts brought their books together and burned them in the sight of all. And they counted the value of them and found it came to fifty thousand pieces of silver. So the word of the Lord continued to increase and prevail mightily.
This passage is not instruction to believers about confessing sins to priests as a form of sacrament or church governance.
The context here is the city of Ephesus where those who had practiced magic arts turned to Christ, became believers, gathered together and burned their scrolls. And as they did that, they confessed their involvement in the occult.
And it is a correct thing to do in those circumstances, although not mandatory.
To yank that verse out of context and use it and apply it to force people to submit to church authority is a gross misuse of scripture.
If you want to use Scripture to provide support for confessing to a priest in a confessional as a general rule laid down for all believers to have to obey, you're going to have to try harder.
Excellent.
I think Romans make fantastic believers when they finally hear the Gospel of Grace and get off the Hamster Wheel of Guilt. They are so grateful to know Christ personally and have salvation.
Amen. A thousand times Amen.
That would include the RC "venial sins".
As the gift is free...there is NOTHING we can do to earn it....no good work....no getting "cleaned up" or "paying off a debt" in purgatory.
As we read this in the context of Romans, and the NT, it is clear the believer has eternal life in Christ. It's a done deal.
No where does the NT say God gives the free gift and then takes it back.
Then you may understand your error over Colossians 3:25
You need to go back and re-read it in the context of the verses just before and after it. That will help give the meaning of the passage in question.
It's a fair question and one I'd think a RC who teaches the classes you do should be able to answer.
Thanks bro. By the way, another thing, in this area. Matthew 24:13 “But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.” Some think this refers to Heaven or Hell. I don’t think so. I think it simply refers to those who physically survive the tribulation period, and by it’s context, is not talking about Heaven or Hell, but simple physical survival. Your thoughts?
I agree because Matthew 24 is about the end of the age and the tribulation period.
Jesus isn’t talking about church age believers who are saved by grace through faith in Christ. They are given the gift of God in salvation, and you don’t have to endure unless you are earning something.
And in the context of Natural Law, which has the same Author as Scriptural Law. Romans 2.
As one of our fellow dialog partners remarked, we've hit a logjam and ought to give it a rest.
Mark17,
• This section of Mt. is correlates with Daniel’s 70th week.
• You must distinguish between “disciples” and believers.
• During this 7 year time of tribulation, many will turn from the following Him.
• They are not believers, but disciples.
• Those who are alive at the end of this period will be saved physically by the return of Christ.
• So you are correct. This is not heaven or hell, but survival through the most horrific time of history.
Imagine the relief they will have, when they see Christ coming in glory on the clouds!
If you would like more, let me know by pm and I will send you some notes.
Best
“And in the context of Natural Law, which has the same Author as Scriptural Law.
But NOT the same authority.
What is revealed in nature is insufficient, or God would not inspired Scripture.
Somebody mentioned the hamster wheel of sin, guilt, fear.
All Christians will at some point or another sin post-salvation.
We struggle, we fail, we seek forgiveness, get up and continue the walk.
The ones who live in sin, even flaunting it are the ones I’d question.
I think if we’re all honest with ourselves, we see that we sin daily. That doesn’t mean we excuse it, relish in it, and continue it. Sanctification is a life-long process.
If we could stop sinning immediately after salvation, then there wouldn’t be much of a struggle. Paul refers to it in sports terms as a race, a marathon (1 Corinthians 9:24-25). There’s a lot of bumps, trips, and falls in the process.
A few examples are “righteous” folks who sinned severely even after they were saved:
Abraham
Lot
Moses
David
Peter
Thomas
Demas (some say he was never saved - i disagree)
And every other Christian who has ever lived...
Very interesting insight.
Thank you from a fellow struggling sinner.
I think many of us are often on the same page without even noticing it and that we hold core substantial beliefs in common and it may only be trivial issues that separate us.
May the Peace of Christ Jesus be with us all.
7
Don’t let the devil lie to your mind about you being “unworthy”. Guess what? Nobody is worthy - even your most self-righteous pious person needs Christ (and we know what HE thought of the self-righteous when he was here).
Read the parable of the two men praying (Luke 18:10-14)
Precious words from our Savior.
We’re not excusing sin, but we know we need to lean on Christ DAILY for our struggles. There’s a war for your soul. Remember that!
For further reading from the late Jack Kelley:
https://gracethrufaith.com/ask-a-bible-teacher/can-we-lose-our-salvation/
https://gracethrufaith.com/topical-studies/the-bibles-authority/bible-say-introduction-sin/
God Bless You!
Lean on Christ, renew yourself in Him, trust in Him, and feed your soul His Word daily. It’s a war!
AMEN!
For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places.
7
And in response your prevaricating Purgatorial propagation was reproved, by the grace of God. See #155 and #197 . Not that there cannot be a cost to sins that are forgiven, but the doctrine that this means postmortem "purifying punishments" commencing at death, and in order to make one good enough to be with God is false. However, as you were told therein, "Now i see that no matter how your compelled defense of Rome is refuted you just keep posting the same..."
Amen!
1 Peter 5:8
Be sober-minded; be watchful. Your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.
1 Peter 1:13
Therefore prepare your minds for action. Be sober-minded. Set your hope fully on the grace to be given you at the revelation of Jesus Christ.
Don’t believe anything you read or hear from somebody else without verifying it first with Scripture.
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