[John O]

At all times there is a man involved.

A man whom the courts have said time and time again has no vote in the process.

The 'mother' can murder her child or keep her child or place her child for adoption regardless of what the father says about it. A man cannot stop the murder of his unborn child if the 'mother' desires to kill that child.

Even if he is married to the mother he can still not stop her from murdering the child.

[stanne]

You lost me at the courts are in charge.