Vote by School Board against pledge angers residents - WAY TO FREEP!!

Wisconsin Stat Journal ^ | 10:31 PM 10/09/01 | Doug Erickson Education reporter

[jgrubbs]

Vote by School Board against pledge angers residents

10:31 PM 10/09/01
Doug Erickson Education reporter


Hammered by constituent criticism and denounced as "oddballs" by Gov. Scott McCallum, the Madison School Board quickly retreated Tuesday from its opposition to the Pledge of Allegiance.

The board will reconsider its decision at a special meeting next week, said Board President Calvin Williams. In the interim, schools will again have the option of using the pledge or national anthem daily.

"We're human," Williams said. "We did not consider all the ways this could be interpreted or misinterpreted."

News of the board's decision spread quickly across the country, with nationally syndicated radio commentator Rush Limbaugh among those deriding it.

"This policy will quickly become a national embarrassment for the entire state," predicted Rep. Steve Nass, R-Whitewater.

At a sparsely attended meeting Monday, the board voted 3-2 to prohibit schools from using the pledge as a way to comply with a new state law. The law requires all schools to offer the pledge or anthem daily in grades one to 12. The board instructed schools to play an instrumental version of the anthem.

At the time, board members said they'd heard from dozens of parents and teachers who objected to the pledge for religious and political reasons. Now they're hearing from the other side.

By mid-afternoon Tuesday, the district's main office had logged 249 phone calls and 172 e-mails against the board's decision. Some people said they'll work to recall board members. Others threatened to withhold their property taxes, pull their children from the district or move to another city.

"We're the laughingstock of the Midwest," said one critic, Jo Toltzien of Madison.

The two board members absent from Monday's meeting - Ray Allen and Juan Jose Lopez - thumped their colleagues Tuesday. "What the board has done is truly unfortunate and, quite frankly, stupid and embarrassing to the city, the school district and the state," Allen said. Lopez said the board's vote will destroy some of the district's hard-won respect.

Veterans groups vowed to mobilize. "People are really, really ticked off about this thing," said Mike Furgal, state adjutant quartermaster for the 47,000-member Wisconsin Veterans of Foreign Wars. "I've had calls from as far away as Appleton saying they'll be bringing carloads of people to Madison for the next board meeting."

Phil Stratton of Madison, a Vietnam War veteran, said he spent Tuesday calling every veterans group and reserve unit in the state. "I'm sickened by this."

McCallum seemed to question the citizenship of board members. "I wonder what country these people are from," he said Tuesday in a statement. "Most Wisconsinites are looking for ways to enhance our armed forces and support our country; some people are looking for ways to diminish our belief in God and country. It is disheartening, but in a free country you have patriots and you have the freedom for a few oddballs who place politics above patriotism."

Board members reported a huge backlash. "I'm getting a lot of negative phone calls, ones where people don't even want to listen to what I have to say," said Carol Carstensen. She voted with the majority but said Tuesday she didn't fully understand the motion and never intended to prohibit teachers from leading the pledge in their classrooms if that had been their custom.

But she said she remains concerned that peer pressure is forcing some kids to participate in the pledge or anthem when they really don't want to.

Williams said the special board meeting is needed because even board members "aren't clear" on the meaning of the motion they approved. He said the policy was misconstrued by some people as an attempt to completely remove the pledge from Madison schools. The board was trying to protect the rights of students and staff members who do not want to feel compelled to join in. It meant no dishonor to the country, he said.

"We want to emphatically state that you can be patriotic in our schools if you want to," Williams said.

Board member Bill Keys, who made the motion Monday to restrict use of the pledge, said he'd received vitriolic calls from people as far away as California and Alabama. Despite the opposition, he said his position has not changed.

"I believe my motion was the right one, and I would not change it in any way," he said.

He said his intent was unambiguous: "The pledge cannot be used as an officially sanctioned activity to comply with the state law," he said. "But students can still say it before school or between classes. No one's objecting to that."

By requiring only instrumental versions of the "Star-Spangled Banner," Keys said he was responding to "a number of people opposed to the militaristic tone and phraseology" of its lyrics. Also, by eliminating the words, the district reduces the likelihood that students who object to the lyrics would be harassed for their views, he said.

Keys said that his motion does not necessarily reflect his own view on the issue but that he was being sensitive to concerns raised by constituents.

Supporters of the board's decision, including the Freedom From Religion Foundation in Madison, feared Tuesday that the board will reverse itself.

"The anthem is a practical choice and it's a legal choice," said Anne Gaylor, foundation president. The group objects to the line "one nation, under God" in the pledge.

Gaylor faults legislators for burying the new state law in the recently approved biennial budget instead of introducing it as a bill that would have received a thorough public debate. "This discussion should have happened a long time ago," she said. "But we have these religious zealots, these dingbats, in the Legislature who put a policy matter in the budget where it didn't belong."

Parent Jeff Henriques said he hopes the School Board has the courage to hold firm to its decision. "I was really pleased with the board decision because it seemed like a workable solution, one that recognized the limitations of the Pledge of Allegiance and still met the letter of the law."

A survey of other state school districts shows controversy over the new state law limited mainly to Madison. The pledge is being recited daily in Wisconsin Heights schools, and parents are supporting the practice, said Superintendent Roberta Felker.

Monona Grove schools are complying with the law by either reciting the pledge or singing the anthem, said Superintendent Gary Schumacher. "The implementation of the law is a local decision," he said. "How Madison is reacting is probably the best decision for their community and I think we've done the same here."

Parents, students and teachers in the Iowa-Grant School District seem firmly behind the pledge there, said Superintendent Linda Hernandez, but she said she understands that it would be more difficult for the Madison School District to find a policy that would satisfy everyone.

"I think they have to appeal to a more diverse group," she said.


State Journal reporters Scott Milfred, Valeria Davis-Humphrey and Beth Williams contributed to this report.

[YOMO]

The board will reconsider its decision at a special meeting next week, said Board President Calvin Williams

Perhaps they all need to go back to SKOOL!!!!!

[browardchad]

Ari Fleisher just said at today's White House press briefing that saying the Pledge of Allegiance would be a good way for kids to feel they are helping their country. A co-incidence?

[winna]

And if they believe that they shouldn't pledge allegiance to the USA then they and anyone else who doesn't like this country and what it stands for should get a one-way ticket to a more suitable country! I notice that you are siding with the fact that they shouldn't have to recite the Pledge - maybe you should find some other place to live also.

I think you misunderstood my post too. I am adamently AGAINST the ban on the pledge of allegiance. I think everyone SHOULD say it, but as a realist I know there is a very small minority who, for one reason or another, do not want to say it. They have that right - no one was FORCED to say it. Peer pressure is not an excuse for banning it. The kids who don't want to say it will have to deal with any peer pressure that results from their decision. That's life.

[gatex]

"...but your analogy is just STUPID...."

And you ?

[LeeMcCoy]

"But she said she remains concerned that peer pressure is forcing some kids to participate in the pledge or anthem when they really don't want to."

Tough! Don't like it, leave.

I'm sure saddam, et al would be far more liberal and allow people exercise their beliefs in utter freedom.</ sarcasm>

[cyberwatcher]

Probably not a coincidence. Most Americans feel the same. And kids need to feel they are doing something to help the nation.

[Gelato]

BUSH ADMIN URGES SIMULTANEOUS PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE IN ALL NATION'S SCHOOLS

Tuesday October 9 5:28 PM ET

Paige Urges Schools to Recite Pledge

WASHINGTON (AP) - If all goes as planned, many of the nation's 52 million students will simultaneously recite the Pledge of Allegiance on Friday. On Tuesday, Education Secretary Rod Paige urged all 107,000 public and private elementary and secondary schools to take part in a campaign organized by the nonprofit Celebration U.S.A. In a letter sent to principals, Paige noted that since the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, Americans have supported the victims, their families, rescue workers and the military. ``Today I ask students, teachers, parents and other proud Americans across the country to join me in showing our patriotism by reciting the Pledge of Allegiance at a single time and with a unified voice,'' Paige wrote. ``We can send a loud and powerful message that will be heard around the world: America is `one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.''' The pledge will be recited at 2 p.m. EDT on Oct. 12, and at the corresponding times in the other U.S. time zones. Paige will participate from a Washington-area school. Paige spokeswoman Lindsey Kozberg stressed that taking part in the synchronized pledge recital is voluntary.

Villa Park, Calif.-based Celebration U.S.A., founded by a retired teacher, distributes educational materials to schools to help students learn about American democracy and patriotism.

The Pledge of Allegiance was first published in 1892, and has been changed twice since - to substitute ``the flag of the United States of America'' for ``my flag'' in 1924 and to add ``under God'' in 1954. It was officially recognized by the U.S. government in 1942.

---

Is the Madison school board going to be with the President on this one?

[mc5cents]

I especially like the way they squirm and lie when the light hits them.

Yea. And have you ever seen cockroaches scramble when you turn the light on? Sorta like that too.

[alieno nomine]

Well, perhaps "despicable" humans would be more like it.
There's no end to the stunts they will pull to bring down the next generation.

Throw them out, I say. They can peddle their mushsy_PC_krap in Kabul.

[AppyPappy]

But she said she remains concerned that peer pressure is forcing some kids to participate in the pledge or anthem when they really don't want to.

And if peer pressure prevents kids from speaking in favor of the war, that's OK with Ms. Coward.

[AppyPappy]

She voted with the majority but said Tuesday she didn't fully understand the motion

"Gosh, teehee, what are you guys talking about? teehee. I don't understand. You boys wouldn't be trying to confuse little ole me, would you? teeheehee"

[okiecowgirl]

Are they trying to change the pledge by leaving out ONE NATION UNDER GOD? This angers me. I hope the meeting is filled with crowds out into the streets. It's time we become more vocal. When the law came out about no prayer in the schools, my Superintendant said we could continue having the Lord's prayer because he couldn't think of a better thing to go to jail for. GOD BLESS AMERICA AND OUR NATION'S SCHOOL CHILDREN.

[2nd amendment mama]

Sorry - I did misunderstand you. Apology extended.

[AppyPappy]

I get a turn:

Teacher: "Hey, Betty, you'll fail if you don't study."
Betty: "Gee, Teach, I just don't want to study. I want to have sex and take drugs and listen to my coconut."
Teacher: "Everyone studies. If you don't, everyone will think you're a failure. ."
Betty: [hesitating] "Well, maybe I should study even though I don't want to."
Coconut: "No one cares about my feelings".

[KeyLargo]

There is only one way to interpret the school board's actions

TREASON!

[Redbob]

"'We're human,' Williams said. 'We did not consider all the ways this could be interpreted or misinterpreted.'"

Translation:'Oh sh*t, people WERE paying attention after all!'

[Redbob]

Calvin Williams (608) 233-1400
Juan José López, Treasurer; 2532 Fairfield Place (53704) 242-5473
Ray Allen, Clerk; 26 Sumter Court (53705) 829-2772
Carol J. Carstensen 720 Orton Court (53703) 255-5931

And all the rest at
http://www.madison.k12.wi.us/boe.htm

[Hillary 666]

"I think they have to appeal to a more diverse group," she said.

The pledge doesn't name any specific religion, color, or ethnic group. But it still isn't diverse enough? What the hell?

Oh, I forgot. "Diverse" is code for "liberal". If the kids were beating drums and singing the praises of any other country in the world, then that would be okay.

[OLDWORD]

Mega Bump, buddie! Official start date will be Monday, November 5, 2001. Let's rock 'n roll!!1

[Redbob]

And now they're not answering their phones.